Enterolab Panel C question

trialanderror · Post by **trialanderror** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 6:52 pm

I recently received my results for panels A + C from Enterolab. Numeric results were presented for gluten, casein, egg, and milk (and I was reactive to those 4 items, with numeric results above 10). I also tested reactive to beef and oats. Thus I have a few questions:

1. If I had an immunological reaction to beef, is it reasonable to assume I shouldn't eat other red meats such as lamb, buffalo, etc.? Likewise, if no reaction to chicken, is it reasonable to assume I can eat other bird meats such as turkey, duck, etc.

2. I don't understand why numeric values are provided for gluten, soy, egg, and dairy, but not for beef, oats, etc. I asked twice and Enterolab gave the same unsatisfactory answer about not wanting people to equate the number with severity.

I understand that it is incorrect to equate the number with the severity, but why then are numeric values presented for gluten, soy, egg, and dairy? I don't understand why numeric values are reported for some foods, but not all. Does this mean there is something different between the reaction to gluten, soy, egg, and dairy vs beef and oats? Does this mean that beef and oats are less inflamatory than gluten, soy, egg, and dairy?

Thanks

sarkin · Post by **sarkin** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 7:01 pm

These test results don't correlate with the same sorts of symptoms and outcomes that the gluten/etc. tests do. You should feel free to call them, and they will explain it better.

Panel C is more like the MRT tests, which give you a sense of which foods are more/less reactive, but you still really have to test them to see how you do.

Many members here cannot tolerate chicken, but can eat turkey; or can eat lamb but not beef. Similar, our reactions to each types of nuts can be very different, so your results on cashews/almonds/walnuts don't really tell you how you will do with pecans or macadamia nuts. Unfortunately.

The purpose of those tests is to start with eliminating the "most reactive" foods, and then test those that are low-reactive or intermediate. It ups the odds that you'll be picking safe foods, among those foods that are known to be likely troublemakers.

So yes - they do work a bit differently. And even with gluten, casein, etc. - having a higher number does not necessarily equate with severity. If you test positive, you are reacting to gluten - but some people with numbers through the roof were not necessarily having more dramatic reactions than others whose numbers on those tests were positive, but not "high positive."

I found the nurse at Enterolab helpful on the phone - hope you have the same experience,

Sara

Post by **tex** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 8:22 pm

To add to what Sara posted, the individual tests for gluten, casein, soy, and egg are very specific, (that's why they're offered as individual tests). The other panel is a different type of test thats more affordable, but yields "indications" and "guidelines", rather than specific test values. To test all of those foods in that panel individually, with the same degree of specificity as the other individual tests, would cost over a thousand dollars, which most clients would he unable or unwilling to spend, (for those particular foods).

FWIW, those tests were not available back when I ordered some tests, (years ago), but I found by trial and error that I was sensitive to beef and oats, (just like you). However, the beef only caused minor bloating, upper back and shoulder pain, and a headache. Oats, on the other hand, caused me to have D, just like with gluten, within 2 or 3 hours of eating it, once my sensitivity matured. IOW, the severity of reactions are somewhat unpredictable for foods in that class, and reaction severity and symptoms often vary by the individual.

The bottom line is that the tests for those 11 foods in panel C, are not anywhere near as specific as the individual tests, (that's why the test is so much more easily affordable, for so many foods). They're intended to be used as guidelines, and those results are not necessarily chiseled in stone. As Sara pointed out, you won't get numeric values for MRT, either, because it's a type of mediator response test, rather than an ELISA test.

Tex

trialanderror · Post by **trialanderror** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:05 pm

I am not sure I understand your answers. The verbatim writing in my test results was as follows for Panel C:

Food toward which you displayed most immunologic reactivity: Oat, Beef
Food for which there was no significant immunologic reactivity: Chicken, Tuna, Cashew, Walnut, Pork, Corn, Almond, Rice, White potato

It then went on to state that I had no reaction to white potato.

So from Sara's response, I understand that since I reacted to gluten, dairy, soy, and egg I need to stay away from those foods. But I may be able to eat oat and beef???

So I planned on not eating oat and beef, in addition to gluten, dairy, soy, and egg. I guess those two foods will be the first ones I try to add back in if I ever get regular.

This might be the least tasty Thanksgiving ever :)
Thanks,

Lesley · Post by **Lesley** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:19 pm

I would read those results to mean no oats, and no beef, since you had the MOST immunological response to them.
The insignificant would be my go-to's for food. It's a pretty good list.

I would start with chicken and rice, add other things from that list plus a few overcooked veggies, and watch how it goes.

That's my take as a beginner in all of this.

Post by **tex** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:09 pm

So from Sara's response, I understand that since I reacted to gluten, dairy, soy, and egg I need to stay away from those foods. But I may be able to eat oat and beef???

So I planned on not eating oat and beef, in addition to gluten, dairy, soy, and egg. I guess those two foods will be the first ones I try to add back in if I ever get regular.

Yes, that's the way I would approach it. The odds are pretty decent that you will indeed react to oats and beef, but after you've been in remission for a while, a little trial and error testing with them, (one at a time, of course), will give you a definitive answer.

This might be the least tasty Thanksgiving ever :)

Well, there are some mighty tasty recipes floating around, that exclude those items. It takes a little thought and planning to adapt to using different ingredients that are safe for us, but that doesn't mean that our meals have to be tasteless. I don't enjoy my meals any less now, than I did previously, and they taste much better than they did back when I was sick all the time.

Tex

Lesley · Post by **Lesley** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:38 pm

Chicken, Tuna, Cashew, Walnut, Pork, Corn, Almond, Rice, White potato

I think that's a great list. You can make some great dishes with those ingredients. Even with my far smaller list I am not eating stuff that's not tasty. Everything I make is tasty. My problem is that my choice is very restricted.
Are you with family for Thanksgiving?

Robin · Post by **Robin** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:59 pm

How long did it take you to get your test results back? Its over 3 weeks and I still haven't got mine back.

Thanks
Robin

PS I think I enjoy my food more now because my list is so small of what I do eat. It makes me challenge my cooking skills. I have made a few bad choices of ingredients and the garbage can ate it. But over all I really enjoy eating now.

Lesley · Post by **Lesley** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:28 pm

Took a bit over 3 weeks. Call them tomorrow. If the results are ready they will email them to you. I had to remind them.

My list is also very small. I haven't really enjoyed my food because of the GERD and the discomfort I feel. I have always been a good cook, so I have always made tasty food, and in the past years I have mostly done stuff that is quickly and easily prepared. Now I seem to be shopping a lot, cooking a lot with very few ingredients, and trying to be ingenious with them to make something new.

I am looking forward to the day that I really enjoy a meal.

trialanderror · Post by **trialanderror** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:09 am

Thanks for your replies.

2 follow up questions:

1. Tex you said "once my sensitivity matured" What do you mean by that?

2. It looks like I should NOT assume that I can not eat other red meats just because I tested reactive to beef (sorry for the double negative). In other words, I should feel free to try other red meats because I may not be reactive to them.

Post by **tex** » Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:38 am

trialanderror wrote:1. Tex you said "once my sensitivity matured" What do you mean by that?

I had to "develop" an oat sensitivity, because I hadn't eaten oats since my food-sensitivity genes had been triggered, (IOW, I hadn't eaten any oats in probably 8 or 10 years, so I had no avenin antibodies circulating in my blood. The thread at the following link, (and the threads at the links provided in that thread, describe how my oat sensitivity developed and "matured". One or two members suggested that I might have been eating oats contaminated with wheat gluten, but that can easily be ruled out, because if the oats had been contaminated, it wouldn't have taken 6 weeks for the first reaction to occur - I would have reacted immediately.

http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6013

As a followup, to verify that my sensitivity had indeed matured, I tested oats one more time, as described in the thread at this link:

http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6036

trialanderror wrote:2. It looks like I should NOT assume that I can not eat other red meats just because I tested reactive to beef (sorry for the double negative). In other words, I should feel free to try other red meats because I may not be reactive to them.

I agree. The only way to be sure is to try other meats, but I would assume that the test results are correct, until proven otherwise. Beef is the only meat that has ever caused any noticeable symptoms for me, and after I was in remission for a couple of years, I could once again eat beef with no problems. Pork always worked fine for me, as did poultry, fish, etc.

Tex