Zizzle,
That's an interesting sidebar! I seem to vacillate between C and D when I'm reacting, but for me there is always a fair amount of discomfort involved. I have almost never had the "painless, watery D" that is the hallmark of IBS (which makes me wonder why I was diagnosed as such). My EDS daughter seems to be hypermobile in the digestion department as well as in her joints: as soon as food hits her stomach, she's off to the bathroom. Her BMs are normal, though. I don't think I have a histamine reaction to any foods, but dairy and potatoes blow me up like a balloon within an hour or so of eating them, and then I have cramping and sometimes D afterwards.
Another interesting thing I have been pondering today: my husband, who swears he has no food intolerances, does not regularly react to a particular food (much like I didn't before going GF), but when he does have a reaction, it is swift and fierce. Hits within the hour, with explosive, reeking D and cramping so bad it has caused him to pass out before. It occurs to me that he has an awfully quick reaction time, which points to something in the stomach.
Curiouser and curiouser.
peripheral neuropathy
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
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draperygoddess
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Yes Sara, something big and important IS happening when peripheral neuropathies show up. I am more at home with this sort of discussion that the ones about the physiology of the gut, because I know nerves and the effects of damage.
I have NO idea whether gluten causes or affects neuropathies, though I can see how it can happen. I know that I have bilateral damage to 2 of the 3 main nerves to the arm and hand (median and ulnar). It was proved through EMG (OUCH) testing many years ago,. Whether the damage was caused by gluten or purely muscular skeletal causes I know not.
I DO know that polio left me with some muscular skeletal imbalances in my body, for which I had to compensate. So some, if not all, of the neuropathy, is muscular skeletal in origin.
I also have a trigger finger - the middle finger of my right hand hurts like hell, and constantly makes me regret any activity that requires me to flex my fingers around anything.
My left foot - I hurt my back at work. I herniated a disk, which put a lot of pressure on the L4/5 nerve root (sciatic) causing neuropathy all along the route of the nerve right to my left foot. After unsuccessfully trying to get it better through PT, exercise etc., I finally had surgery.
Unfortunately scar tissue formed on the nerve itself. A second surgery attempted to clean out all the possible ins and outs of the spinal column, and lift the scar tissue off the nerve.
It didn't work. So now I have increased neuropathy along my L leg and to my foot, but not only on the route of the main nerve. It also appears along the tributaries.
And now I have evidence of damage to the right side at the same level, but appearing more in the sacro-iliac joint (the one many doctors have refused to admit IS a joint - surprised?) than beside the spine.
The lower extremity neuropathy was initially caused by my accident, which could have also been exacerbated by the polio imbalances. Whether gluten sensitivity has worsened it is anybody's guess.
So what comes first? Muscular skeletal issues or gluten induced problems? Since it is well known that diabetes causes neuropathy particularly in the lower extremities, it makes sense that with gluten sensitivities the same type of nutritional deficits in their turn can cause neuropathy over the years
In my case I can't be sure what caused the neuropathy I have in all the peripheries of my body. I just know they are there and very uncomfortable.
Cynthia, since you have given up gluten and have removed the nutritional irritants, now it is time to address the muscular skeletal issues (and Sara, this applies to you too). Can I ask you if you have noticed that the "going to sleep" occurs in any particular position? Does it happen every night? All sorts of questions that need answers in order to decrease the muscular skeletal influence on this problem so that further damage can be prevented.
Tex, I can so identify with you. I was far from remission when I did the tests (as I am now), but the whole process seemed to hold some hope for recovery. I still have the MRT to go through, and I look forward to it in the same way.
I have NO idea whether gluten causes or affects neuropathies, though I can see how it can happen. I know that I have bilateral damage to 2 of the 3 main nerves to the arm and hand (median and ulnar). It was proved through EMG (OUCH) testing many years ago,. Whether the damage was caused by gluten or purely muscular skeletal causes I know not.
I DO know that polio left me with some muscular skeletal imbalances in my body, for which I had to compensate. So some, if not all, of the neuropathy, is muscular skeletal in origin.
I also have a trigger finger - the middle finger of my right hand hurts like hell, and constantly makes me regret any activity that requires me to flex my fingers around anything.
My left foot - I hurt my back at work. I herniated a disk, which put a lot of pressure on the L4/5 nerve root (sciatic) causing neuropathy all along the route of the nerve right to my left foot. After unsuccessfully trying to get it better through PT, exercise etc., I finally had surgery.
Unfortunately scar tissue formed on the nerve itself. A second surgery attempted to clean out all the possible ins and outs of the spinal column, and lift the scar tissue off the nerve.
It didn't work. So now I have increased neuropathy along my L leg and to my foot, but not only on the route of the main nerve. It also appears along the tributaries.
And now I have evidence of damage to the right side at the same level, but appearing more in the sacro-iliac joint (the one many doctors have refused to admit IS a joint - surprised?) than beside the spine.
The lower extremity neuropathy was initially caused by my accident, which could have also been exacerbated by the polio imbalances. Whether gluten sensitivity has worsened it is anybody's guess.
So what comes first? Muscular skeletal issues or gluten induced problems? Since it is well known that diabetes causes neuropathy particularly in the lower extremities, it makes sense that with gluten sensitivities the same type of nutritional deficits in their turn can cause neuropathy over the years
In my case I can't be sure what caused the neuropathy I have in all the peripheries of my body. I just know they are there and very uncomfortable.
Cynthia, since you have given up gluten and have removed the nutritional irritants, now it is time to address the muscular skeletal issues (and Sara, this applies to you too). Can I ask you if you have noticed that the "going to sleep" occurs in any particular position? Does it happen every night? All sorts of questions that need answers in order to decrease the muscular skeletal influence on this problem so that further damage can be prevented.
Tex, I can so identify with you. I was far from remission when I did the tests (as I am now), but the whole process seemed to hold some hope for recovery. I still have the MRT to go through, and I look forward to it in the same way.
Well, at this point, Tex, I'd take full advantage of whatever is available now that could be informative. When my Grandson's kit was sent in early this year, we ordered the whole shebang, the tests had been greatly expanded from when I had them done in Nov. '09.
I was thinking that gluten was my only issue, being a double DQB1, but recently it's been pretty obvious that I have a tapioca problem. This was originally set off by 2 "cracker/nut" snacks that I ate and immediately suffered from. So, that was Thursday, Friday I had some UDI's bread, had some again on Sat., looked at the ingredients and voila! Tapioca. I am still miserable. The gift that keeps on giving.......I only had this bread because I had it on set for others who were GS and now I'm trying to get my DH to go GF, so I pulled it out of the freezer and made toast for breakfast both days. Won't do that again.
I was thinking that gluten was my only issue, being a double DQB1, but recently it's been pretty obvious that I have a tapioca problem. This was originally set off by 2 "cracker/nut" snacks that I ate and immediately suffered from. So, that was Thursday, Friday I had some UDI's bread, had some again on Sat., looked at the ingredients and voila! Tapioca. I am still miserable. The gift that keeps on giving.......I only had this bread because I had it on set for others who were GS and now I'm trying to get my DH to go GF, so I pulled it out of the freezer and made toast for breakfast both days. Won't do that again.
Resolved MC symptoms successfully w/L-Glutamine, Probiotics and Vitamins, GF since 8/'09. DX w/MC 10/'09.
Connie,
It seems that tapioca flour is used in most of the better GF breads, unfortunately. I guess it must be tough to make good GF bread without it.
At one time, I was a fan of Anna's bread, (Manna from Anna, which is now Breads from Anna), but it finally dawned on me that I seemed to react to tapioca, also, so I stopped using all bread.
I'll give that some thought - I may order that test before I send in the sample. I'm running out of guts to test, so I might as well test 'em while I still got 'em.
Tex
It seems that tapioca flour is used in most of the better GF breads, unfortunately. I guess it must be tough to make good GF bread without it.
At one time, I was a fan of Anna's bread, (Manna from Anna, which is now Breads from Anna), but it finally dawned on me that I seemed to react to tapioca, also, so I stopped using all bread.I'll give that some thought - I may order that test before I send in the sample. I'm running out of guts to test, so I might as well test 'em while I still got 'em.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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draperygoddess
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Lesley,
Like you, I have some residual damage due to injury, and I also have degenerative disc disease. However, this is not related to those issues, as far as I can tell. The little toe (and sometimes the side of that foot) will go numb, like when you sit crosslegged too long and your foot falls asleep--except that it happens when I'm sitting on the couch, lying in bed, driving, standing at the sink...I don't have back pain associated with it, so I doubt it's related to my other disc issues. It's just weird. My feet and toes have always done this from time to time, but I didn't think anything of it. It's just happening more frequently these days.
Tex,
Like you, I have some residual damage due to injury, and I also have degenerative disc disease. However, this is not related to those issues, as far as I can tell. The little toe (and sometimes the side of that foot) will go numb, like when you sit crosslegged too long and your foot falls asleep--except that it happens when I'm sitting on the couch, lying in bed, driving, standing at the sink...I don't have back pain associated with it, so I doubt it's related to my other disc issues. It's just weird. My feet and toes have always done this from time to time, but I didn't think anything of it. It's just happening more frequently these days.
Tex,
You crack me up!! Love your sense of humor!I'm running out of guts to test, so I might as well test 'em while I still got 'em.
Cynthia
"Can we fix it? YES WE CAN!" -Bob the Builder
"Can we fix it? YES WE CAN!" -Bob the Builder
I had a problem with my hands or arms, or feet or legs, falling asleep and not wanting to wake up, about a year ago. It happened more frequently with my hands and arms, than it did with my feet or legs. It often happened when I was in bed, but sometimes it happened when I was sitting at a computer, or driving, etc. Somewhere about that time, my fingers began to occasionally lock up, in an extended position while I was asleep, and the only way I could get them to flex, would be to take the other hand, and fold them down. After that, they would be OK. Sometimes it happened to one or the other hand, and sometimes it happened to both hands at the same time.
I became suspicious of the statin I was taking, and on February 20th, I stopped taking it. After a couple of months, my fingers stopped locking up, (and that has never happened again, since about the middle of April), and my hands and arms, and feet and legs, stopped falling asleep, and failing to "wake up". They occasionally fall asleep, but now they wake up, as they should, when I try to move them. I took the statin for about 9 months, (minimum dose). I consider myself lucky to be able to walk away from that near disaster.
Tex
I became suspicious of the statin I was taking, and on February 20th, I stopped taking it. After a couple of months, my fingers stopped locking up, (and that has never happened again, since about the middle of April), and my hands and arms, and feet and legs, stopped falling asleep, and failing to "wake up". They occasionally fall asleep, but now they wake up, as they should, when I try to move them.
I took the statin for about 9 months, (minimum dose). I consider myself lucky to be able to walk away from that near disaster.Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Stanz and Tex
Arrowroot can be used as an exact replacement for tapioca starch. It's more expensive, but it can be purchased in 20 oz. bags at Whole Foods and online for about $6 the last time I bought it. I don't use very much of it in a recipe, replacing some of it with cornstarch.
I'm sure cost is why tapioca is used in breads and mixes instead of arrowroot. They both provide cohesiveness and crunchiness to baked goods.
Gloria
Arrowroot can be used as an exact replacement for tapioca starch. It's more expensive, but it can be purchased in 20 oz. bags at Whole Foods and online for about $6 the last time I bought it. I don't use very much of it in a recipe, replacing some of it with cornstarch.
I'm sure cost is why tapioca is used in breads and mixes instead of arrowroot. They both provide cohesiveness and crunchiness to baked goods.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
Gloria,
Thanks, that's good to know, if I should ever crave bread again. Since I'm able to eat corn, tortillas work fine for me.
Tex
Thanks, that's good to know, if I should ever crave bread again. Since I'm able to eat corn, tortillas work fine for me.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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draperygoddess
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- Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:49 am
- Location: Tennessee
Thanks for the Arrowroot info, Gloria. I'll look for bread w/o tapioca, but doubt it's out there. I just frankly gave up on all bread from the beginning and haven't missed it much and don't have the patience to bake my own anymore. Imagine tapioca is an additive in most GF mixes out there though and I've got a bag of tapioca flour that's still unopened. 
My 2 cents on the peripheral neuropathy - since that's what this thread is about - I've had it for years, particularly in my hands. Recently my ND studied with John Lyftogt, a NZ doctor who is pretty well known as the "father of prolotherapy" which is what I've been having done to replace lost cartilage caused by years of autoimmune response due to the gluten. The prolotherapy has been a godsend and for the past month he's been experimenting on me with neural prolotheraphy where he is using dextrose injections to stimulate the nerves to repair nerve damage, which will then theoretically aid in repairing the joint damage.
My fingers used to get icy cold and literally turn white and numb from lack of blood flow at the drop of a hat. Since having the neural prolo, it has improved greatly, so we'll see.
Tex, tortillas are fine with me too. I use lettuce as a bread substitute in sandwiches most of the time, but I've got all this homemade jam................
Here's a link to info on neural prolo:
http://www.centralcoastpaininstitute.com/id19.html
My 2 cents on the peripheral neuropathy - since that's what this thread is about - I've had it for years, particularly in my hands. Recently my ND studied with John Lyftogt, a NZ doctor who is pretty well known as the "father of prolotherapy" which is what I've been having done to replace lost cartilage caused by years of autoimmune response due to the gluten. The prolotherapy has been a godsend and for the past month he's been experimenting on me with neural prolotheraphy where he is using dextrose injections to stimulate the nerves to repair nerve damage, which will then theoretically aid in repairing the joint damage.
My fingers used to get icy cold and literally turn white and numb from lack of blood flow at the drop of a hat. Since having the neural prolo, it has improved greatly, so we'll see.
Tex, tortillas are fine with me too. I use lettuce as a bread substitute in sandwiches most of the time, but I've got all this homemade jam................
Here's a link to info on neural prolo:
http://www.centralcoastpaininstitute.com/id19.html
Resolved MC symptoms successfully w/L-Glutamine, Probiotics and Vitamins, GF since 8/'09. DX w/MC 10/'09.
Yes, I haven't had any bread for several months, either. I don't really miss it, but it was convenient when travelling to throw a sandwich together. Now I do the tortilla thing, too.Tex wrote:Thanks, that's good to know, if I should ever crave bread again. Since I'm able to eat corn, tortillas work fine for me.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
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draperygoddess
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- Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:49 am
- Location: Tennessee
I haven't had good luck with corn tortillas--I'm not sure why, since I can eat other corn and it doesn't bother me. Don't know if the ones I've had were cc with something else, or what. Haven't seen rice tortillas yet, but I will keep looking! I really miss fajitas.
Cynthia
"Can we fix it? YES WE CAN!" -Bob the Builder
"Can we fix it? YES WE CAN!" -Bob the Builder
Interesting point, Cynthia - it would be pretty easy for corn tortillas to be cross-contaminated somewhere along the line, if made or pacakged on shared equipment.
Corn tortillas aren't hard to make, though... It helps to have a skilled tortilla-maker show you how the first time, but I bet the Internet is full of helpful videos (it sure is for knitting!).
Love,
Sara
Corn tortillas aren't hard to make, though... It helps to have a skilled tortilla-maker show you how the first time, but I bet the Internet is full of helpful videos (it sure is for knitting!).
Love,
Sara
Cynthia,
Be sure to read the labels on corn tortillas, because I've been advised that in many parts of the country, (outside Texas), they often contain wheat flour.
. Also, in many parts of the country, it's common for corn to be cross-contaminated with soybeans, due to harvesting practices. Some farmers harvest corn in the mornings, and switch over to soybeans in the afternoon, (after all the moisture from the morning dew has dried), which means that the first batch of corn will contain soybeans left over from the previous day, in the combine, grain carts, trucks, etc.) Grain elevators usually reject corn that contains more than 3% soybeans, (number 2 corn standards), or 2% soybeans, (number 1 corn standards, which is the standard used for food grade corn), but 2% soybeans would be 20,000 parts per million, which is a heck of a lot, for a food allergen.
Tex
Be sure to read the labels on corn tortillas, because I've been advised that in many parts of the country, (outside Texas), they often contain wheat flour.
. Also, in many parts of the country, it's common for corn to be cross-contaminated with soybeans, due to harvesting practices. Some farmers harvest corn in the mornings, and switch over to soybeans in the afternoon, (after all the moisture from the morning dew has dried), which means that the first batch of corn will contain soybeans left over from the previous day, in the combine, grain carts, trucks, etc.) Grain elevators usually reject corn that contains more than 3% soybeans, (number 2 corn standards), or 2% soybeans, (number 1 corn standards, which is the standard used for food grade corn), but 2% soybeans would be 20,000 parts per million, which is a heck of a lot, for a food allergen.Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.