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It's been 3+ weeks on the Paleo diet and since I stopped taking Celebrex. I had a very painful attack of indigestion after going to bed one night, complete with cold sweats etc and stopped Celebrex the next day. I coincidentally saw my GI doc the next week, described the symptoms and he thought it was gastritis brought on by Celebrex.
I've had two more attacks of severe indigestion pain since then. I'm wondering if the heavy protein load can also cause indigestion. Before starting the paleo diet I ate red meat perhaps once a week or not at all, chicken twice a week and seafood once a week. I was also eating a lot of sugar and I KNOW that caused problems. Those problems weren't painful just annoying. Those gastritis attacks are very, very painful and a bit scary. I notice that since starting the paleo diet I don't have much gas at all and I used to putt-putt a lot, like having a small motor misfiring behind me. During the last bad attack I was finally able to get up a few belches and that did help. I'm beginning to think that all of this meat is just too much for my digestive system to handle. I think I'm going to add back breakfast cereal with almond milk half the time and eat breakfast sausage the other times. I tried making my own sausage and the results were definitely disappointing. Jones makes a GF and sulfite free sausage that is good. Yesterday I made a chicken sandwich with my homemade GF bread and had no bad reaction at all. I'm also continuing to lose weight even though I'm stuffing my face with muffins, nuts, etc. I'm going to try a modified paleo diet, leave out the nightshades completely because I think my arthitis is better without them. I'm going to slowly add back some of my favorite foods, no brownies though. It is tempting to try those avocado brownies but that is a long way down the road. I do feel better overall since starting the paleo diet but I think I have to take a slow step back to a modified paleo diet.
I still have not taken the MRT test. The company is located a few miles away from my home and I can't get them to respond to e-mails or phone calls. I'm tempted to just show up at their office. Anyone else had a problem contacting Oxford/Signet labs?
So, does anyone else get indigestion from eating too much meat? Any tips or ideas about modifying the paleo diet would be greatly appreciated. I am so sick of thinking about food and making food and buying food and eating food; it's getting really old.
Thanks, everyone.
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Indigestion problems associated with protein digestion are often due to insufficient stomach acid. Have you ever tried Betaine HCL? Some people have found that one pill before each meal containing a significant amount of protein can speed up digestion and prevent indigestion.
As we age, our ability to produce stomach acid diminishes, which makes digestion proceed more slowly, and can result in incomplete digestion. When the digestive process takes too long, food can begin to spoil, resulting in the symptoms of indigestion.
If acid production ability is severely limited, some people find that a higher dose of Betaine HCL is necessary to get results.
I took it for a while when I was recovering (and it helped), but I kept forgetting to take it before each meal, so I finally just gave up. I probably should be taking it now, because my digestion is much slower than it used to be, but unfortunately my memory hasn't improved any either.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thank you Tex. I will get the Betaine HCL and use it, if I remember. It is horrifying to think that I'm rotting from the inside out. "Because you are getting older" has been the refrain from doctors for a while now. I started taking Tums thinking an antacid would help but I guess that is not a good idea if I am lacking sufficient acid. Would eating acidic food help too? I had been eating a lot of tomatoes and haven't had one in 3+ weeks. They are nightshades and not allowed so I would have to find a substitute.
Again, it's Tex to the rescue.
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila,
As a compatriot in the land of severe gastritis - I had gone back on 2 nexium an day in desperation. Then I read your post about going cold turkey from the purple pill, and decided I have to get away from it again, but trying to decrease it slowly, while trying other methods of control.
I am now trying to control the GERD with apple cider vinegar. I have been putting it in my blender with ice, some sweetener and a little banana, or something like that to make it more palatable.
I forgot about the Betaine. I need to get it and add it in. Maybe I will manage to drop it altogether over time.
Maybe, but most foods are not acidic enough to have a major effect. The pH of stomach acid is normally around 1.5 to 2.0, when everything is working correctly. Tomatoes have a pH of around 4.0 to 4.5. Limes, though, have a very low pH of 2.0, and lemons run around 2.2. Pears run slightly below 4.0, peaches check out at 3.5, strawberries at 3.4, and plums have a pH of slightly under 3.0. The pH of undiluted apple cider vinegar typically ranges between 4.25 and 5.0.
You're most welcome. I hope it helps.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Sheila, I don't know if what Tex is recommending is the same as Bromelain, but that is what I take to help break down proteins. It's a natural Enzyme I believe.
Lesley, I never took Nexium because I never had gastritis before it occured a few weeks ago. I took a couple of Tums a day thinking it might help. The vinegar cocktail sounds truly horrible. I think I'll stick with the Betaime HCL that Tex recommended and if I can't find that I'll look for Bromelain. I eat some fish but am not crazy about it. A favorite restaurant serves it crusted with shredded sweet potatoes and I'm determined to learn how to make the potatoes stick. Delicious and GF.
Thanks, Leah for the info re Bromelain. I never heard of anything like this because I have never had gastritis or Gerd symptoms. Hopefully, the health food store will be open tomorrow and I'll start right away. I don't want to experience another attack ever again.
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila, try dipping in rice flour (or whatever kind of flour you can tolerate) and then something that's moist and then the sweet potatoes. The flour usually creates a kind of glue.
Thank you for the suggestion Deb. In order to be paleo I think I'll try using almond flour, egg, s & p, grated sweet potato. Lordy, I can't wait to try it. My step-son gave me a strawberry grouper filet that I've had in the freezer for a while. This is the perfect recipe to try. The fish is so good, it would be hard to mess it up too badly. At the restaurant they serve it over salad greens, mango (which is everywhere down here right now), snap peas, tiny green beans and tomato. Some of those aren't paleo but I'm sure I won't have trouble finding subsitutes. Perhaps avocado would be a good substitute. I'll let you all know how it turns out.
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
I'd definitely try the Betaine HCl. A couple of months after I started on this diet I also developed pretty severe stomach pain. Cider vinegar helped a little for a few minutes, but not for long. Once I started taking Betaine with every meal (I don't take it before, only with, my meal, along with my vitamin C and D), I started feeling better right away. Now I take a pill with each meal, and while I occasionally have stomach pain, it's rare and bearable.(I don't usually forget the Betaine for very long though - the pain generally reminds me within s couple of hours, certainly by the next meal!)
Lesley, I didn't realize you weren't taking it. You definitely need to try it - it has helped me a LOT. (You might need to take two per meal because your pain is so bad, but even one ought to I've you an idea whether it would help. If the vinegar is helping a little, the Betaine will likely help quite a bit.)
The "HCL" in "Betaine HCL" stands for hydrochloric acid. Gastric acid is hydrochloric acid.
Here is a blog by a doctor discussing why the problem is insufficient acid, not excess acid. (IOW, most PPIs are prescribed inappropriately, and do just the opposite of what is actually needed -- this amounts to iatrogenesis on a grand scale.)
The comments responding to Dr. Eades' blog are interesting, also.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thanks for the link. I'm going to send it to my oldest son who has suffered from GERD since his 30's. He is a pretty indiscriminate eater, jalapena poppers being favorites. It's a wonder his stomach doesn't explode. It is certainly worthwhile for him to try this.
It is amazing how many of our illnesses are exacerbated by our doctors. They have become so specialized, so focused on their small area of expertise, they are sorely deficient in other areas, i.e. nutrition. Even better, the "family" doctor who has no idea who I am when I walk in the office. Usually, I see his assistant, a very nice girl, but not a doctor. I'm going to have to switch but it is such a pain in the butt to do so.
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Tex, there is an article in this month's Living Without magazine about acid and Betaine HCL. It is interesting because I tried the first Betaine HCL today and did not have a good result. After reading the article in the magazine I think I took too high a dose for the amount of food that I eat. I don't eat much and the capsule is 250 mg with pepsin. When I took it I had eaten 2/3's of 1 chicken/apple sausage, 1 C of banana smoothie for breakfast at 6:30 a.m., 1 C coffee, 1/2 roast beef sandwich and 1 morning glory muffin. I took the capsule at about 2 p.m. At around 5 pm I started feeling fullness and pressure at the bottom of my throat that intensified. Felt a little like what I would expect reflux to feel like. I took 2 Tums and the discomfort receded.
Tomorrow I'll try 1/2 capsule and see what happens. I feel fine after dinner and that too was pretty small. I made sweet potato crusted snapper (1/2 of a filet) and 1/2 C cauliflower grits. Remembered what I don't like about cauliflower. It smells bad. However, it tasted pretty good shredded and cooked with chicken stock and almond flour.
So, is the amount of Betaine HCL dependent upon the amount of food consumed? Does the content of the food matter? I saw on one bottle not to take if only eating salad. The article said not to take it indefinitely or your body just stops making enough acid on its own.
Thanks, Tex and/or anyone else with insight into this problem,
Sheila W
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
I've never tried any Betaine HCL that contained Pepsin, so I have no idea what a proper combined dose should be. The stomach produces pepsinogen, and hydrochloric acid (HCl) converts pepsinogen to pepsin, which begins the digestion process by splitting proteins into peptides. Normally, the recommended dose of Betaine HCL (alone) is 600 to 1200 mg. The Betaine HCL should be taken at the beginning of a meal or during a meal (so that it's available when digestion is actually taking place). There's not much benefit in taking a Betaine HCL capsule after a meal is mostly digested. If taken after the stomach is almost empty, the hydrochloric acid may burn the stomach lining.
Yes, the dose depends on the volume of food that needs to be digested. As far as the type of food is concerned, it helps the most for digesting proteins and fats, so yes, it probably wouldn't provide much benefit for digesting high fiber foods such as salads. It works best for substantial meals, with a significant amount of protein, and it may not work very well for smaller meals and snacks. You would need to adjust the dose according to protein content and overall volume, for each meal.
I'm sure that article is correct that the excessive use of a hydrochloric acid supplement will eventually train the stomach to make less acid, just as taking more thyroid supplement than needed eventually induces the thyroid to produce less thyroxine, and taking a corticosteroid causes the adrenals to produce less cortisol. IOW, don't take more Betaine HCL than you need to get good digestion.
If you eat half a meal, and take a Betaine HCL capsule, a warm sensation in the stomach roughly 2 minutes after you take it is a good sign (that's a sign that it's working properly, and the dose is about right). No warm feeling probably means that you didn't take enough. On the other hand, a burning sensation a couple of minutes after you take it is not a good sign (that's a sign that you're using too much). Once you determine the correct dose, that dose should work fairly consistently for similar meals.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
It is horrifying to think that I'm rotting from the inside out. "Because you are getting older" has been the refrain from doctors for a while now. I started taking Tums thinking an antacid would help but I guess that is not a good idea if I am lacking sufficient acid. Would eating acidic food help too? I had been eating a lot of tomatoes and haven't had one in 3+ weeks. They are nightshades and not allowed so I would have to find a substitute.
