I'm Posting This Against My Better Judgment :shock:

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tex
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I'm Posting This Against My Better Judgment :shock:

Post by tex »

Hi All,

This research was published today, and the results seem counterintuitive, so I'm highly suspicious of the findings (I think that in general, the benefits of plant sterols are overrated), but I can't find anything wrong with the article, so I'm posting it FYO.
WASHINGTON, Dec. 6, 2013 /PRNewswire/ -- Corn oil significantly reduces cholesterol with more favorable changes in total cholesterol (TC) and LDL-C than extra virgin olive oil, new research shows.
New Study Finds Corn Oil Superior to Extra Virgin Olive Oil in Lowering Cholesterol

Of course we all know that lowering cholesterol is irrelevant anyway, and that lowering cholesterol should never be considered to be a goal of any health program (since cholesterol is an irrelevant marker) — the important issue is the overall effect on health or longevity, or mortality risk, or something else that actually matters, and research proves that lowering cholesterol has no effect on overall mortality risk. Nevertheless, this is an interesting turn of events, if it turns out to be true.

I can't find the original article online, so we have no information on the effects on triglycerides.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by Gloria »

Interesting. I've been comparing the nutrients of corn oil, canola oil and almond oil, and found that canola oil has the highest amount of vitamin K, almond oil has the highest level of vitamin E, and corn oil has the highest level of linoleic acid. I've decided to continue using all three. It's nice to know that corn oil can reduce cholesterol levels, since I hear from my doctor about that, too. :smile:

Gloria
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Post by tex »

Sesame oil is another possibility that supposedly fares better than olive oil according to research, including triglycerides:
Conclusions:

Sesame oil had equivalent effect on lipid profile in comparison olive oil and lipid profile improvement was better in sesame oil in LDL-C and TG.
Olive and Sesame Oil Effect on Lipid Profile in Hypercholesterolemic Patients, Which Better?

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by Leah »

I react to Canola oil, but corn seems to be OK…. not that I need to lower my cholesterol ( it's usually around 145)

Leah
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Post by Zizzle »

Sorry, I call BS on this one, namely because...
About Biofortis
Biofortis, a Merieux NutriSciences company, is a leading global clinical nutrition research team serving industry leading clients from the food, ingredient and dietary supplement industry segments.
The research was entirely paid for by the food industry -- which in this country, is pushing for corn consumption over foreign olive consumption. A study of 54 people is hardly significant, but it's enough to produce headlines to change people's cooking oil buying habits. Shame on them.


And they studied all lipid levels, but only reported on LDL and total cholesterol. I'd like to know what happened to HDL levels?
Corn oil lowered LDL cholesterol by 10.9 percent compared to extra virgin olive oil's 3.5 percent reduction1,2, and total cholesterol decreased by 8.2 percent with corn oil compared to 1.8 percent for extra virgin olive oil.2
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tex
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Post by tex »

Zizzle,

Good catch. I may have to stop posting about controversial articles after sundown, because I even read that line that you quoted before I posted the link, and it's significance never even registered on my brain. :roll: Apparently when the chickens go to roost, so does the conscious part of my brain. :lol:

Thanks for catching that. I knew there was something wrong with it, but I was too sleepy to figure it out.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by DJ »

I agree that when it comes to research, you get WHAT YOU PAY FOR! I have a friend who is/was a PhD research scientist and left the field due to an inability to cope with the corruption. I hope that not all research is corrupt but I'm sure that plenty of it is :???: So, how do you weed the good from the bad? For example, there were so many positive findings related to the benefit of vitamin D before doctor got on board :roll:
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Post by tex »

Dr. Ioannidis and his team have been researching the accuracy and reliability of conclusions reached in scientific research articles for years. Here are some quotes from, and a link to an article that he published in 2005:
It can be proven that most claimed research findings are false
He offers 6 corollaries with detailed explanations (and scientific references) for each that I have truncated for brevity in this quote:
Corollary 1: The smaller the studies conducted in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. . . .

Corollary 2: The smaller the effect sizes in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. Power is also related to the effect size. . . .

Corollary 3: The greater the number and the lesser the selection of tested relationships in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. . . .

Corollary 4: The greater the flexibility in designs, definitions, outcomes, and analytical modes in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. . . .

Corollary 5: The greater the financial and other interests and prejudices in a scientific field, the less likely the research findings are to be true. . . .

Corollary 6: The hotter a scientific field (with more scientific teams involved), the less likely the research findings are to be true. . . .
The red emphasis is mine, of course.

Why Most Published Research Findings Are False

Here is a quote from (and a link to) an article published in 2010 in Science Magazine:
During the past century, though, a mutant form of math has deflected science’s heart from the modes of calculation that had long served so faithfully. Science was seduced by statistics, the math rooted in the same principles that guarantee profits for Las Vegas casinos. Supposedly, the proper use of statistics makes relying on scientific results a safe bet. But in practice, widespread misuse of statistical methods makes science more like a crapshoot.

It’s science’s dirtiest secret: The “scientific method” of testing hypotheses by statistical analysis stands on a flimsy foundation. Statistical tests are supposed to guide scientists in judging whether an experimental result reflects some real effect or is merely a random fluke, but the standard methods mix mutually inconsistent philosophies and offer no meaningful basis for making such decisions. Even when performed correctly, statistical tests are widely misunderstood and frequently misinterpreted. As a result, countless conclusions in the scientific literature are erroneous, and tests of medical dangers or treatments are often contradictory and confusing.

Conflict between frequentists and Bayesians has been ongoing for two centuries. So science’s marriage to mathematics seems to entail some irreconcilable differences. Whether the future holds a fruitful reconciliation or an ugly separation may depend on forging a shared understanding of probability.

“What does probability mean in real life?” the statistician David Salsburg asked in his 2001 book The Lady Tasting Tea. “This problem is still unsolved, and ... if it remains un­solved, the whole of the statistical approach to science may come crashing down from the weight of its own inconsistencies.
Statistical significance is not always statistically significant.
Again, the red emphasis is mine.

Odds Are, It's Wrong — Science fails to face the shortcomings of statistics

IMO, the safest approach is to simply assume that the conclusions in any report you are reading are incorrect, and you will be right most of the time. :shock:

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by Rosie »

My husband was in the pharmaceutical research field for quite a few years. His favorite saying was:

"If it takes a statistician to determine whether a drug works or not, then the drug isn't worth much."

Of course that only annoyed folks in the industry...... He got burned out, left corporate life 15 years ago, and has done other, more worthwhile things with his life since then!

Rosie
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Post by tex »

Rosie wrote:"If it takes a statistician to determine whether a drug works or not, then the drug isn't worth much."


Now that's a truism that definitely appeals to me, but I can certainly see how the folks who rely on that sort of BS as part of their job or their business might tend to take offense. :lol:

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by Lesley »

I am going to do this test:
http://requestatest.com/vap-cholesterol ... fgodDX8AbA

If my platelets are large I will never have to worry about my high cholesterol and I can get my doc off my back. I have wanted to do it for while, but things have been very tight and there is something each month that precludes it.
I have had so many expenses connected to my back - my deductibles for the MRI and other tests, the walker, the pot expenses (though I don't use much) etc., etc. It all adds up.
It's "only" $129, but I haven't had the money for the last few months. Hopefully this month....I really believe it's worth it. I will keep you posted.
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Post by JFR »

Tex,

I read Dr Ionnidis some years ago. Thank you for reminding me of his research. If we get our "science" from the headlines in the news we are bound to be getting bad science. Unless we read the original research articles and also know how to critique research ourselves, there is little chance that what we believe to be true or are told is true is actually true. One thing that always stands out for me is that group research is only that, group research. It does not tell you about individuals or give individuals much guidance about how to conduct themselves. I remember when oat bran was all the rage and you could find it in almost everything purporting to be "healthy". Then there are the low fat advocates so that the label low fat is taken to mean healthy. And there are the vegetarians who believe that their way of eating is the healthiest and of course the most ethical. And there is the much touted Mediterranean diet now about to be supplanted by corn oil rather than olive oil? Personally I eat a paleo diet and believe that it is the healthiest way to go but the fact that I believe that whole heartedly does not make it so even if it seems to work for me. I also believe that we always have to be skeptical because whatever is being claimed today is sure to be supplanted with something else tomorrow. My approach is more pragmatic than theoretical. The way I eat seems to be the way that keeps me able to function and feeling reasonably well.

Jean
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