I seem to remember someone mentioning something about sour smelling stools but I can't find that now. Also, has anyone ever had mouth sours? almost like your mouth's been acidic? I woke with one side of my mouth and the same side of my tongue looking like it'd been soaked in acid or listerine. Could this be from stomach acid maybe coming up in my sleep (I do get stomach acid that sort of regurgitates at times), and maybe pooling on one side? Or maybe from falling asleep w/ gum in my mouth?
The sour smell, and increased intestinal and stomach burning has also been a problem, so I'm wondering if the three are connected. I did try qunoa the other day, and it came through undigested, so I know that's a problem, but the burning has occurred since before my ER visit for what they thought was pancreatitis (although my GI's questioning the ERs diagnosis--long story)
Can't find old thread--sour smelling stools
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
Hi Jennifer,
Mouth sores are very common while we are reacting, and I too had them. They are a result of excessive mast call activity. Mouth sores can usually be prevented by diet changes (stop eating high-histamine foods, or foods that trigger the release of histamine in the body). Taking an antihistamine may help, also (but probably not if the diet is loaded with too much histamine).
The first GI system reaction I ever had was an allergic reaction to a mouthwash that I had used without any problems for many years. I was probably in my mid-20s when one morning I swished some of it around in my mouth, and my mouth suddenly felt as though it were on fire. I spit it out and looked in the mirror, and sure enough, most of the interior of my mouth was as red as a beet with inflammation, and still burning. I tried it one more time, the next day, with the same result. That was the last time that I ever used a mouth wash.
That said, I suppose it's possible that you might have been burned by stomach acid, but for that to happen, your throat should have also been on fire. And that sort of defies medical logic, because the more acidic the stomach contents, the tighter the lower esophageal sphincter (LES) clinches, so we are much more likely to regurgitate acid when the acidity of the stomach is weak, and far less likely to experience reflux when the stomach contents are very acidic. That's why the logic behind the use of PPIs to treat acid reflux is faulty, and PPIs are counterproductive — they make GERD worse, but we don't notice it as much, because the acid is weaker, so it doesn't burn as much. Unfortunately, using a PPI slowly weakens the LES muscles, so that after a few weeks, it becomes virtually impossible to stop using a PPI, because PPIs cause the very problem that they are prescribed to treat — talk about an iatrogenic drug.
Never sleep on your right side, and you will never have to worry about reflux while you're sleeping. Sleeping on our right side is an invitation to develop reflux problems, because that position places the inlet to our stomach above the LES. Lying on our back, or on our right side, preempts that problem.
Gum may be a problem, because much of it contains traces of gluten (dusted on conveyors to prevent the gum from sticking, during the manufacturing process).
All the symptoms that you listed are the result of a disrupted digestive system (the inflammation associated with MC tends to significantly compromise many stages in the digestive process, especially those that involve the production of digestive enzymes.
Remember that just because a food passes through the digestive system substantially undigested does not mean that the food caused a reaction. It means that our digestive system is too inflamed to produce sufficient quantities of the specific enzymes necessary to digest that particular food. That said, it is known that certain brands of quinoa produced in South America are sometimes cross-contaminated with gluten. Always buy a kosher brand, in order to avoid that problem.
Here are links to past threads about foul-smelling stools, with the most recent listed first
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
So what does your GI doc think is causing the burning problem?
Tex
Mouth sores are very common while we are reacting, and I too had them. They are a result of excessive mast call activity. Mouth sores can usually be prevented by diet changes (stop eating high-histamine foods, or foods that trigger the release of histamine in the body). Taking an antihistamine may help, also (but probably not if the diet is loaded with too much histamine).
The first GI system reaction I ever had was an allergic reaction to a mouthwash that I had used without any problems for many years. I was probably in my mid-20s when one morning I swished some of it around in my mouth, and my mouth suddenly felt as though it were on fire. I spit it out and looked in the mirror, and sure enough, most of the interior of my mouth was as red as a beet with inflammation, and still burning. I tried it one more time, the next day, with the same result. That was the last time that I ever used a mouth wash.
That said, I suppose it's possible that you might have been burned by stomach acid, but for that to happen, your throat should have also been on fire. And that sort of defies medical logic, because the more acidic the stomach contents, the tighter the lower esophageal sphincter (LES) clinches, so we are much more likely to regurgitate acid when the acidity of the stomach is weak, and far less likely to experience reflux when the stomach contents are very acidic. That's why the logic behind the use of PPIs to treat acid reflux is faulty, and PPIs are counterproductive — they make GERD worse, but we don't notice it as much, because the acid is weaker, so it doesn't burn as much. Unfortunately, using a PPI slowly weakens the LES muscles, so that after a few weeks, it becomes virtually impossible to stop using a PPI, because PPIs cause the very problem that they are prescribed to treat — talk about an iatrogenic drug.
Never sleep on your right side, and you will never have to worry about reflux while you're sleeping. Sleeping on our right side is an invitation to develop reflux problems, because that position places the inlet to our stomach above the LES. Lying on our back, or on our right side, preempts that problem.
Gum may be a problem, because much of it contains traces of gluten (dusted on conveyors to prevent the gum from sticking, during the manufacturing process).
All the symptoms that you listed are the result of a disrupted digestive system (the inflammation associated with MC tends to significantly compromise many stages in the digestive process, especially those that involve the production of digestive enzymes.
Remember that just because a food passes through the digestive system substantially undigested does not mean that the food caused a reaction. It means that our digestive system is too inflamed to produce sufficient quantities of the specific enzymes necessary to digest that particular food. That said, it is known that certain brands of quinoa produced in South America are sometimes cross-contaminated with gluten. Always buy a kosher brand, in order to avoid that problem.
Here are links to past threads about foul-smelling stools, with the most recent listed first
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewt ... ing+stools
So what does your GI doc think is causing the burning problem?
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thank you, Tex, Well, besides the gum... I chew a lot of gum as I have a bad case of dry mouth that drives me crazy! I will have to check to see if maybe that is my problem. Wow. That would be interesting, to say the least.
I am GF/SF/DF/egg free, and fructose free, but I did try quinoa two days prior, and the day after I ate the quinoa, I had intense burning (including my eyes, etc.), so maybe the mouth sores were the result of that. Of course, it could be that I have an issue with almonds as I had almond butter a couple hours before bed.
I haven't seen my GI since my ER visit. The ER said I had pancreatitis, but my blood levels were fine, which is why I wondered about an ulcer. And I figured I could manage myself well if I stayed away from fructose and too much fat. But I'll talk to her during my next visit and see what she thinks. She is actually very quick to suggest dietary changes. I've just had a tough time figuring out what my triggers are. Someone else on this forum said maybe I had issues with rice and potatoes or chicken. I do think maybe ground beef was giving me problems, so I cut that out.
I will also say, in the shower and in the laundry, I use no dyes or perfumes as I have issues with that, but I could tell something must have contacted my soap (like maybe cleaner? Not sure) because I experienced burning. I know it probably seems odd I'd notice the burning right away, and maybe that was a coincidence, but my from eyes to mouth, to intestines, something triggered a burning of all those types of areas.
*sigh* This gets so exhausting! Between shopping and cooking and laundry, everything feels so insanely complicated! With no margin for error.
I am GF/SF/DF/egg free, and fructose free, but I did try quinoa two days prior, and the day after I ate the quinoa, I had intense burning (including my eyes, etc.), so maybe the mouth sores were the result of that. Of course, it could be that I have an issue with almonds as I had almond butter a couple hours before bed.
I haven't seen my GI since my ER visit. The ER said I had pancreatitis, but my blood levels were fine, which is why I wondered about an ulcer. And I figured I could manage myself well if I stayed away from fructose and too much fat. But I'll talk to her during my next visit and see what she thinks. She is actually very quick to suggest dietary changes. I've just had a tough time figuring out what my triggers are. Someone else on this forum said maybe I had issues with rice and potatoes or chicken. I do think maybe ground beef was giving me problems, so I cut that out.
I will also say, in the shower and in the laundry, I use no dyes or perfumes as I have issues with that, but I could tell something must have contacted my soap (like maybe cleaner? Not sure) because I experienced burning. I know it probably seems odd I'd notice the burning right away, and maybe that was a coincidence, but my from eyes to mouth, to intestines, something triggered a burning of all those types of areas.
*sigh* This gets so exhausting! Between shopping and cooking and laundry, everything feels so insanely complicated! With no margin for error.
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8332
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
Jennifer,
It is very easy to get overwhelmed, mc, histamine and the overwhelmness that can come with, no quick fix, no guaranteed fix all path...
Stop, take a few breathes... Take it one thing at a time....
Progress..... Not perfection.
And have realistic expectations of outcomes...
The aim being to have minimal symptoms most of the time....
Be at peace with what is,
Figure out an eating plan that works most of the time.
Adjust your lifestyle, (home, family, work, hobbies etc ) that works for you
Be mindful of triggers, whether it be mast cell/histamine, stress, dental work,
Yes, sounds easy in words,
Yes, it will take time, it will test your courage, it will challenge some of beliefs that you had pre mc,
The thing I can say, every ounce of energy you invest is worth it.
Take it a day at a time, a week at a time, aim for progress, any hiccups, set backs are learnings... Things will get better, easier...
The mc management plan will become second nature, and it will flow and be routine...
It is very easy to get overwhelmed, mc, histamine and the overwhelmness that can come with, no quick fix, no guaranteed fix all path...
Stop, take a few breathes... Take it one thing at a time....
Progress..... Not perfection.
And have realistic expectations of outcomes...
The aim being to have minimal symptoms most of the time....
Be at peace with what is,
Figure out an eating plan that works most of the time.
Adjust your lifestyle, (home, family, work, hobbies etc ) that works for you
Be mindful of triggers, whether it be mast cell/histamine, stress, dental work,
Yes, sounds easy in words,
Yes, it will take time, it will test your courage, it will challenge some of beliefs that you had pre mc,
The thing I can say, every ounce of energy you invest is worth it.
Take it a day at a time, a week at a time, aim for progress, any hiccups, set backs are learnings... Things will get better, easier...
The mc management plan will become second nature, and it will flow and be routine...
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
I concur with Jeannemcl's statement. :) Gabes, thanks for the encouraging words. And for reminding me to focus on the positives in each step. Jeannemcl, wow, do I know what you mean! We went out of town for Thanksgiving and spent time with folks who love me to pieces but don't really understand my food limitations and why I'm such a sticker for them. They sort of equate it to their wanting to stay away from caffeine or sugar, because they just feel better.
But they don't understand how insanely sick someone w/ lc can get. Nor, it seems do those who claim to be gluten free. The staff at the Hamptom we stayed at. They got angry at me when I asked for eggs that hadn't been dusted by cereal crumbs (as they had their hard boiled eggs tongs next to the cereal dispensers). Not having anything but potato chips to eat the day before (and being now 22 pounds under my healthy weight), I pushed for an unglutened egg (as 1) the hotel staff has assured me they had this option when we checked in; 2) It was as easy as pulling an unglutened egg from their bag of precooked eggs; 3) I had no idea what I'd find to eat the rest of the day and wanted protein.) But everyone got upset, including my husband. So, although I got my egg, I cried. lol. And later got sick, because I'm pertty sure the Thanksgiving turkey had been roasted in honey.
I should've planned ahead more, but I'd been sick with my recent bout of pancreatitis (or whatever landed me in the ER--I dropped 10 pounds in a week and got very dehydrated). And I was overwhelmed just getting us all together to go. Well, and I did pack food, but in the transporting... Long story. Suffice it to say, NOTHING went according to plan.
I really need to find a good way to pack my stuff. But even then, there's the problem of feeling like I need to share when in public settings. (I tend to pack a lot of chips when traveling as I've found them to be a safe food. Three ingredients: potatoes, oil, and sale. ;) )
Christmas, we'll do one overnight that will be easy to pack for, and other than that, I'll be here where I KNOW what goes into the food, what it touched, etc.
I'll admit, what I hate most is the insane amount of time I have to spend thinking about, buying, and preparing food. When I cook, it's for hubby and my daughter. Whenever I'm home alone, I could easily spend 12-16 hours at my computer, grabbing a spooonful of peanutbutter or whatever else is easy when I'm hungry. Now that I have lc, that doesn't work. So I wait, get distracted, or put off going to the store to find when I'm at starving stage, there's either nothing cooked I can eat or nothing to cook.
But they don't understand how insanely sick someone w/ lc can get. Nor, it seems do those who claim to be gluten free. The staff at the Hamptom we stayed at. They got angry at me when I asked for eggs that hadn't been dusted by cereal crumbs (as they had their hard boiled eggs tongs next to the cereal dispensers). Not having anything but potato chips to eat the day before (and being now 22 pounds under my healthy weight), I pushed for an unglutened egg (as 1) the hotel staff has assured me they had this option when we checked in; 2) It was as easy as pulling an unglutened egg from their bag of precooked eggs; 3) I had no idea what I'd find to eat the rest of the day and wanted protein.) But everyone got upset, including my husband. So, although I got my egg, I cried. lol. And later got sick, because I'm pertty sure the Thanksgiving turkey had been roasted in honey.
I should've planned ahead more, but I'd been sick with my recent bout of pancreatitis (or whatever landed me in the ER--I dropped 10 pounds in a week and got very dehydrated). And I was overwhelmed just getting us all together to go. Well, and I did pack food, but in the transporting... Long story. Suffice it to say, NOTHING went according to plan.
I really need to find a good way to pack my stuff. But even then, there's the problem of feeling like I need to share when in public settings. (I tend to pack a lot of chips when traveling as I've found them to be a safe food. Three ingredients: potatoes, oil, and sale. ;) )
Christmas, we'll do one overnight that will be easy to pack for, and other than that, I'll be here where I KNOW what goes into the food, what it touched, etc.
I'll admit, what I hate most is the insane amount of time I have to spend thinking about, buying, and preparing food. When I cook, it's for hubby and my daughter. Whenever I'm home alone, I could easily spend 12-16 hours at my computer, grabbing a spooonful of peanutbutter or whatever else is easy when I'm hungry. Now that I have lc, that doesn't work. So I wait, get distracted, or put off going to the store to find when I'm at starving stage, there's either nothing cooked I can eat or nothing to cook.
The hotel staff was out of line with their attitude. It's easy to understand their thinking that after they went to such "great lengths" to accommodate guests who have food sensitivities, they would be put off by someone who considers their efforts inadequate. But they obviously don't understand the risks of cross-contamination, and they don't understand how serious the consequences of cross-contamination can be, nor do they understand the concept of plain old good manners, for that matter. What happened to the old traditional good business policy of, "The customer is always right?"
And your husband's reaction (while understandable, because he was probably caught off guard, and somewhat embarrassed) clearly illustrates how deeply the concept of denial infects those who are closest to us, and how negatively that attitude affects our own state of mind (our confidence and our sense of well-being). And ultimately, a pattern of denial in our loved ones can complicate and even sabotage our journey back to health. By "denial", I mean a lack of acceptance of the fact that we are actually seriously ill — that we have a life-altering disease that requires major lifestyle changes as part of the treatment program.
Denial is a common problem for newly-diagnosed patients, and until we stop denying that the disease is for real, and that treating it will require major lifestyle changes and hard work, we are unable to effectively deal with the disease. Early on, we continue to hope that it's just a bad dream, or a transient virus or something, and that tomorrow we will wake up and it will be gone. But that never happens of course, so eventually we have to face the fact that this is real, and this is permanent, until we do something to turn it around. Once we accept the reality of our situation, and start developing a treatment program, then denial is no longer a problem.
At least it shouldn't be. But unfortunately it seems to be much more difficult for many of those around us to get past the denial stage, than it was for us to get over it. And their attitude affects our mood. Many of us have found that some of our family members, relatives, and/or acquaintances don't seem to be able to get past the denial stage, and some may never get past it, so we eventually have to accept the fact that they just don't get it, and probably never will, and move on.
The problem is that we don't really look sick. Most people are accustomed to associating a state of serious illness with an appearance that resembles death warmed over. And when they look at us, they don't see that. They see a pretty much normal-looking person. So how could we actually be ill? How sick could we be when we don't look sick? If only they could see the inside of our guts. LOL.
Tex
And your husband's reaction (while understandable, because he was probably caught off guard, and somewhat embarrassed) clearly illustrates how deeply the concept of denial infects those who are closest to us, and how negatively that attitude affects our own state of mind (our confidence and our sense of well-being). And ultimately, a pattern of denial in our loved ones can complicate and even sabotage our journey back to health. By "denial", I mean a lack of acceptance of the fact that we are actually seriously ill — that we have a life-altering disease that requires major lifestyle changes as part of the treatment program.
Denial is a common problem for newly-diagnosed patients, and until we stop denying that the disease is for real, and that treating it will require major lifestyle changes and hard work, we are unable to effectively deal with the disease. Early on, we continue to hope that it's just a bad dream, or a transient virus or something, and that tomorrow we will wake up and it will be gone. But that never happens of course, so eventually we have to face the fact that this is real, and this is permanent, until we do something to turn it around. Once we accept the reality of our situation, and start developing a treatment program, then denial is no longer a problem.
At least it shouldn't be. But unfortunately it seems to be much more difficult for many of those around us to get past the denial stage, than it was for us to get over it. And their attitude affects our mood. Many of us have found that some of our family members, relatives, and/or acquaintances don't seem to be able to get past the denial stage, and some may never get past it, so we eventually have to accept the fact that they just don't get it, and probably never will, and move on.
The problem is that we don't really look sick. Most people are accustomed to associating a state of serious illness with an appearance that resembles death warmed over. And when they look at us, they don't see that. They see a pretty much normal-looking person. So how could we actually be ill? How sick could we be when we don't look sick? If only they could see the inside of our guts. LOL.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Jennifer, that was a traumatic trip for you in so many ways! It is difficult when families just don't "get it." I agree with Tex about the attitude of the staff. Their job is to ensure the guests are pleased. I have started asking to talk to the manager when staff is rude, whether hubbie is embarrassed or not. For too many years I just let it go so everyone was comfortable...but I sacrificed myself for peace. That is very stressful and no wonder you cried. This condition is stressful enough without having to justify our choices!
I rarely think of it ahead of time, but you could ask at check in that 2 eggs will be set aside for you due to contamination issues. Whether they understand or not, it's a service to their customer and not that hard to do.
I rarely think of it ahead of time, but you could ask at check in that 2 eggs will be set aside for you due to contamination issues. Whether they understand or not, it's a service to their customer and not that hard to do.
"It is very difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it. "
Upton Sinclair
Upton Sinclair