Chronic non-bloody diarrhoea: a prospective study in Malmo, Sweden, with focus on microscopic colitis
http://7thspace.com/headlines/457360/ch ... litis.html
New study on MC...
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
New study on MC...
That says absolutely nothing new
Chronic non-bloody diarrhoea: a prospective study in Malmo, Sweden, with focus on microscopic colitis
http://7thspace.com/headlines/457360/ch ... litis.html
Chronic non-bloody diarrhoea: a prospective study in Malmo, Sweden, with focus on microscopic colitis
http://7thspace.com/headlines/457360/ch ... litis.html
1987 Mononucleosis (EBV)
2004 Hypomyopathic Dermatomyositis
2009 Lymphocytic Colitis
2010 GF/DF/SF Diet
2014 Low Dose Naltrexone
2004 Hypomyopathic Dermatomyositis
2009 Lymphocytic Colitis
2010 GF/DF/SF Diet
2014 Low Dose Naltrexone
That figures!
Here's a question that may have been answered someplace, but I don't recall.
Since MC seems to develop due to an imbalance in gut bacteria. What happens, physiologically, that we can't tolerate probiotics to help balance out gut back out after the food allergies are in check? An imbalanced gut is the cause of histamine issues, too, as I've been reading.
5.Probiotics
Allergies are the result of an imbalance in the immune system that causes the body to react too strongly to a stimuli. New research links the presence of beneficial bacteria in the gut with reduced incidence of allergies. Evidence is even emerging that a mother’s gut bacteria during pregnancy and nursing can impact a child’s likelihood of getting allergies throughout life.
While we can’t do much about our mothers’ diets while they were pregnant, balancing gut bacteria now and consuming enough beneficial bacteria can have a positive effect on allergies now. Fermented foods and drinks like Kombucha or Kefir can hep boost gut bacteria, as can a high quality probiotic capsule.
From: http://wellnessmama.com/8370/7-natural- ... gy-relief/
I haven't tried kombucha yet, but my husband drinks it.
I'm just trying to get spring allergies in check since I don't do well with OTC antihistamines, I'm trying everything I can naturally.
Here's a question that may have been answered someplace, but I don't recall.
Since MC seems to develop due to an imbalance in gut bacteria. What happens, physiologically, that we can't tolerate probiotics to help balance out gut back out after the food allergies are in check? An imbalanced gut is the cause of histamine issues, too, as I've been reading.
5.Probiotics
Allergies are the result of an imbalance in the immune system that causes the body to react too strongly to a stimuli. New research links the presence of beneficial bacteria in the gut with reduced incidence of allergies. Evidence is even emerging that a mother’s gut bacteria during pregnancy and nursing can impact a child’s likelihood of getting allergies throughout life.
While we can’t do much about our mothers’ diets while they were pregnant, balancing gut bacteria now and consuming enough beneficial bacteria can have a positive effect on allergies now. Fermented foods and drinks like Kombucha or Kefir can hep boost gut bacteria, as can a high quality probiotic capsule.
From: http://wellnessmama.com/8370/7-natural- ... gy-relief/
I haven't tried kombucha yet, but my husband drinks it.
I'm just trying to get spring allergies in check since I don't do well with OTC antihistamines, I'm trying everything I can naturally.
Linda :)
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
I'll take a stab at that, and remember that this is just my opinion, not medical fact. Here's the reason why (IMO) we can't tolerate probiotics when MC is active. It's pretty simple, actually (at least it seems obvious and straightforward to me):Linda wrote:Since MC seems to develop due to an imbalance in gut bacteria. What happens, physiologically, that we can't tolerate probiotics to help balance out gut back out after the food allergies are in check? An imbalanced gut is the cause of histamine issues, too, as I've been reading.
Some invasive event (be it a bacterial or viral infection) causes the VDRs to be activated, in order to empower the immune system to adequately deal with the infection. Whenever the VDRs are activated, many genes associated with fighting infections become active, and the immune system operates at a state of high alert and maximum sensitivity. In this hypersensitive state (the immune system equivalent of calling out the National Guard to declare marshal law), any suspicious-appearing invaders (probiotics, for example) will immediately be rounded up, confronted, and if they don't have the proper "paperwork" on them, they will be immediately executed (which, of course, will add to the inflammation, since additional pro-inflammatory modulators will be released to accomplish this job).
Only after the immune system is sure that the coast is clear, will the VDRs be deactivated, so that the production/release of additional pro-inflammatory mediators will cease, and eventually natural attrition will allow a condition of calm to return to the scene. Note that if not enough vitamin D is available, though {in the form of 25(OH)D}, then there will be no way to deactivate some (possibly most) of the VDRs, and in that situation the pro-inflammatory state will remain in effect.
At least that's how I see it.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thank you, Tex. I understand your reasoning.
So, in your opinion, the reason almost everything I have tried to help me heal (that didn't work, of course) is because my body is in hyper alert. Once remission is achieved, and healing has taken place, is there a need for probiotics? I still don't think I'm in remission, but I feel I'm getting closer.
Another question that I don't recall the answer to....has anyone been able to eat foods from their Enterolab testing that tested as a #2 eventually, or is all on an individualized basis? I'm just thinking ahead, and since I only eat some nuts/seeds, meat and veggies, I was hoping to get a grain/ grass back in eventually.
Thanks!
So, in your opinion, the reason almost everything I have tried to help me heal (that didn't work, of course) is because my body is in hyper alert. Once remission is achieved, and healing has taken place, is there a need for probiotics? I still don't think I'm in remission, but I feel I'm getting closer.
Another question that I don't recall the answer to....has anyone been able to eat foods from their Enterolab testing that tested as a #2 eventually, or is all on an individualized basis? I'm just thinking ahead, and since I only eat some nuts/seeds, meat and veggies, I was hoping to get a grain/ grass back in eventually.
Thanks!
Linda :)
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
Personally, I think that probiotics are designed to benefit the manufacturers and vendors, not the consumers of those products. But you have to remember that my position is that the fewer freeloading parasites we feed and care for, the better off we are. And at least we don't have to pay for the ones that wander into our guts accidentally.Linda wrote:Once remission is achieved, and healing has taken place, is there a need for probiotics? I still don't think I'm in remission, but I feel I'm getting closer.
But that's just my opinion, and obviously not everyone agrees with that opinion.My concern is that in a free market, there's always someone willing to sell anything that the market will bear, so availability doesn't require efficacy. And just because we have to pay for those bacteria-laden products, doesn't mean that we are any better off than just settling for the status quo (with whatever germs accidentally end up in our gut).
Basically, all that the FDA requires is that the manufacturer be able to prove that the product doesn't kill an unacceptable number of users.
That said, probiotics are thought to offer benefits when taken at the conclusion of an antibiotic treatment regimen, to provide some protection to prevent C. diff from taking over. Under normal conditions though, I'm not convinced that they earn their keep in a healthy digestive system that's performing normally. Of course an entire industry has been developed to try to prove me wrong. That's a good question, and I don't know the answer to it either. I'm guessing that the examples where someone is able to eat those foods, are typically associated with a relatively low overall score for those 11 foods (but I'm just guessing, of course). Since your overall score was relatively high, you would need to very carefully test any of those foods before considering them as a serious option. Hopefully, someone who has been able to successfully add some of those foods back into their diet, will respond with details of their experiences (including their overall score for the 11 foods).Linda wrote:Another question that I don't recall the answer to....has anyone been able to eat foods from their Enterolab testing that tested as a #2 eventually, or is all on an individualized basis? I'm just thinking ahead, and since I only eat some nuts/seeds, meat and veggies, I was hoping to get a grain/ grass back in eventually.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Zizzle, I agree that article was a dud.
Linda-
I'm sure my onset of LC had nothing to do with imbalanced gut bacteria. The inflammation in my upper GI tract was significant. The endoscope I had showed irritation and inflammation in my stomach, and I believe in my esophagus too. My LC is a classic auto-immune reaction to sensitivities I had developed and a strong genetic component (like 2 gene markers for gluten sensitivity), triggered by NSAID use and grief. I think it was developing gradually until I hit a particularly stressful part of life-- my mother died from leukemia (we were very close), I was assigned to a difficult work assignment, my daughter went away to college (which we wanted but it was still an adjustment), and I was trying to help my dad cope plus he had health issues to manage, etc. It was the perfect storm of elements that converged all at once. When I looked at the documented causes of LC I could see how it happened. I find the evidence pointing toward leaky gut syndrome and inflammation as a more plausible reason as to why our lower GI tract can no longer do it's job. Had I not gotten rid of the irritants the inflammation would have continued and so would the dysfunction.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents. Thanks for humoring me.
Carol
Linda-
I have to respectfully disagree on this issue. I think if this were the case then we should be able to put the bacteria back in balance and we'd be well again. And I did try Align and I had much worse lower GI problems resulting from taking it than I did without it. I didn't get the positive response from Align that I did with diet changes, combined with Entocort, Claritin, Zantac and the occasional Benadryl. When the antihistamines took any pain and GERD away, I knew it was an autoimmune reaction.Since MC seems to develop due to an imbalance in gut bacteria.
I'm sure my onset of LC had nothing to do with imbalanced gut bacteria. The inflammation in my upper GI tract was significant. The endoscope I had showed irritation and inflammation in my stomach, and I believe in my esophagus too. My LC is a classic auto-immune reaction to sensitivities I had developed and a strong genetic component (like 2 gene markers for gluten sensitivity), triggered by NSAID use and grief. I think it was developing gradually until I hit a particularly stressful part of life-- my mother died from leukemia (we were very close), I was assigned to a difficult work assignment, my daughter went away to college (which we wanted but it was still an adjustment), and I was trying to help my dad cope plus he had health issues to manage, etc. It was the perfect storm of elements that converged all at once. When I looked at the documented causes of LC I could see how it happened. I find the evidence pointing toward leaky gut syndrome and inflammation as a more plausible reason as to why our lower GI tract can no longer do it's job. Had I not gotten rid of the irritants the inflammation would have continued and so would the dysfunction.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents. Thanks for humoring me.
Carol
“.... people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” Maya Angelou
Thanks for the info, Tex. I really wish that I could do fermented foods though! :(
The question about the Enterolab food testing came from the knowledge that I did score 30 units on the 11 antigenic foods test, and just wondered that eventually, when the leaky gut heals and inflammation is down, and my gut is better healed, would I still have issues with the foods? I'm not sure why once in remission for a period of time, my body would still make antibodies to all of the # 2 & #3 categories.
It is so complicated...histamines & allergies, food sensitivities, stress, additives......
Carol,
I guess I didn't mean to say that MC was only caused by an imbalance in the gut bacteria, but it is one of the multifaceted factors in the mix. I agree that leaky gut, stress, foods, gut motility, genetics, and (definitely) NSAID's etc. are all in the mix. The articles that I was reading, yesterday, were about histamines, and the whole connection with digestive issues. I was trying to make sense of it all.
Thanks for your 2 cents...always appreciated!
The question about the Enterolab food testing came from the knowledge that I did score 30 units on the 11 antigenic foods test, and just wondered that eventually, when the leaky gut heals and inflammation is down, and my gut is better healed, would I still have issues with the foods? I'm not sure why once in remission for a period of time, my body would still make antibodies to all of the # 2 & #3 categories.
It is so complicated...histamines & allergies, food sensitivities, stress, additives......
Carol,
I guess I didn't mean to say that MC was only caused by an imbalance in the gut bacteria, but it is one of the multifaceted factors in the mix. I agree that leaky gut, stress, foods, gut motility, genetics, and (definitely) NSAID's etc. are all in the mix. The articles that I was reading, yesterday, were about histamines, and the whole connection with digestive issues. I was trying to make sense of it all.
Thanks for your 2 cents...always appreciated!
Linda :)
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
Linda,
I have a hunch that when all is said and done, and the dust settles, our sensitivity to so many different foods is connected with a genetic issue that compromises the ability of vitamin D to deactivate the VDRs, so that the immune system is never allowed to return to a normal, calm state. Eventually, some researcher will probably discover why/how that happens.
Personally, I suspect that it may be a result of permanent genetic damage caused by long-term, untreated gluten sensitivity. Obviously there's no proof of that at this point, but we know that gluten can cause nerve damage (including brain damage), and physical damage (for many celiacs, mucosal histology never returns to it's original state, despite rigid adherence to a GF diet), so why wouldn't it be capable of causing genetic damage?
As further evidence of a gluten-based cause for multiple food sensitivities, consider that people who have drug-induced MC can often totally resolve their MC symptoms simply by avoiding the drug (or family of drugs) that triggered their MC initially. They have no food sensitivities once the drug is discontinued, and they can eat whatever they want. Of course, if they don't identify the drug connection soon enough, they tend to develop the same food sensitivities that the rest of us have to deal with, and then they are in the same boat as the rest of us.
Tex
I have a hunch that when all is said and done, and the dust settles, our sensitivity to so many different foods is connected with a genetic issue that compromises the ability of vitamin D to deactivate the VDRs, so that the immune system is never allowed to return to a normal, calm state. Eventually, some researcher will probably discover why/how that happens.
Personally, I suspect that it may be a result of permanent genetic damage caused by long-term, untreated gluten sensitivity. Obviously there's no proof of that at this point, but we know that gluten can cause nerve damage (including brain damage), and physical damage (for many celiacs, mucosal histology never returns to it's original state, despite rigid adherence to a GF diet), so why wouldn't it be capable of causing genetic damage?
As further evidence of a gluten-based cause for multiple food sensitivities, consider that people who have drug-induced MC can often totally resolve their MC symptoms simply by avoiding the drug (or family of drugs) that triggered their MC initially. They have no food sensitivities once the drug is discontinued, and they can eat whatever they want. Of course, if they don't identify the drug connection soon enough, they tend to develop the same food sensitivities that the rest of us have to deal with, and then they are in the same boat as the rest of us.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Wow, Tex.....it is so sad that we are this point in time, and that we have such issues from the foods we've eaten! Maybe in the back of my mind, I always thought this was a temporary condition, and eventually I would heal and only have to be gluten free for the remainder of my life, but it seems to be a lot more intense than that! My mom made everything from scratch, but the explosion of fast foods in the sixties, and so many good tasting processed foods, as well as having the genetics I do, I guess was a cocktail for disaster.
Did you finish your taxes??
Did you finish your taxes??
Linda :)
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
Linda,
Remember that those comments that I made are mostly speculation. No one knows what's really going on. And please don't give up hope, because I certainly didn't make those remarks with the intention of diminishing hope — I made them in the hope of increasing insight and understanding. As we continue to learn more about these problems, surely from time to time we will discover new ways to resolve old issues. Up until a few years ago, for example, we had no idea that antihistamines could be so helpful. No one knows exactly what the future will bring, but we can be sure that it will bring progress.
Knowledge is power, and as knowledge is upgraded, it always propels us toward even more knowledge and understanding. And with improved understanding, comes better solutions. I'm very optimistic for the future.
Tex
Remember that those comments that I made are mostly speculation. No one knows what's really going on. And please don't give up hope, because I certainly didn't make those remarks with the intention of diminishing hope — I made them in the hope of increasing insight and understanding. As we continue to learn more about these problems, surely from time to time we will discover new ways to resolve old issues. Up until a few years ago, for example, we had no idea that antihistamines could be so helpful. No one knows exactly what the future will bring, but we can be sure that it will bring progress.
Knowledge is power, and as knowledge is upgraded, it always propels us toward even more knowledge and understanding. And with improved understanding, comes better solutions. I'm very optimistic for the future.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Tex,
You didn't dash my hopes, and I know there could be wonderful advances right around the corner, but I am a realist. My son was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at age 8, and all I heard from the professionals was that by the time he was in high school, there'd be a cure, and I actually believed that.....but now he is 21 and although there have been advances, nothing has changed for him....blood testing constantly, and 5 shots a day. I suspect big Pharma makes way too much money on the drugs, as with cancer drugs. I know I sound skeptical, and I guess I am, but it just seems to be the way it is.
I hope and pray for better quality of life for all.....maybe I will be pleasantly surprised someday!
You didn't dash my hopes, and I know there could be wonderful advances right around the corner, but I am a realist. My son was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes at age 8, and all I heard from the professionals was that by the time he was in high school, there'd be a cure, and I actually believed that.....but now he is 21 and although there have been advances, nothing has changed for him....blood testing constantly, and 5 shots a day. I suspect big Pharma makes way too much money on the drugs, as with cancer drugs. I know I sound skeptical, and I guess I am, but it just seems to be the way it is.
I hope and pray for better quality of life for all.....maybe I will be pleasantly surprised someday!
Linda :)
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
LC Oct. 2012
MTHFR gene mutation and many more....
IMO there is something to be said for probiotics whether from natural sources or from capsules. If they kill off a lot of bad bacteria then their toxins are released and there is a 'die off' effect that can lead to more problems temporarily. Also if using the capsules a good quality one that has been kept refrigerated is best. I take VSL #3 as prescribed by my GI and also make my own water kefir because I can't tolerate dairy.
Theresa
MC and UC 2014
in remission since June 1, 2014
We must all suffer one of two things: the pain of discipline or the pain of regret. ~Jim Rohn
MC and UC 2014
in remission since June 1, 2014
We must all suffer one of two things: the pain of discipline or the pain of regret. ~Jim Rohn
Linda,
I should know better than to read and write posts late at night, I tend to get more opinionated than usual.
I'm glad you didn't take offense to anything I said.
Carol
I should know better than to read and write posts late at night, I tend to get more opinionated than usual.
I'm glad you didn't take offense to anything I said.
Carol
“.... people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” Maya Angelou
Hi Linda,
I can regularly eat some of my number two and number three foods from my Enterolab scores particularly in the protein category. Here were my test results.
Mean Value 11 Antigenic Foods 18 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)
Food toward which you displayed most immunologic reactivity: Walnut, White potato, Corn, Tuna
Food toward which you displayed intermediate reactivity: Oat, Rice, Beef, Pork
Food toward which you displayed least immunologic reactivity: Chicken, Cashew, Almond
I regularly eat tuna, beef and pork. Protein seems to be no problem. Corn I'm scared to try as the reactions were so severe two years ago. I have rice pasta about 4 x per week as a side. I'm mostly paleo now so I don't have white potato very often but it is no problem if I am out and order potato. Oat--I've not tried and don't think I every will. I think eating oatmeal for breakfast for 30 years contributed to me getting this disease.
It took me two years to get to remission. The big question is if I would have got to remission faster I'd stuck to chicken?
Brandy
I can regularly eat some of my number two and number three foods from my Enterolab scores particularly in the protein category. Here were my test results.
Mean Value 11 Antigenic Foods 18 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)
Food toward which you displayed most immunologic reactivity: Walnut, White potato, Corn, Tuna
Food toward which you displayed intermediate reactivity: Oat, Rice, Beef, Pork
Food toward which you displayed least immunologic reactivity: Chicken, Cashew, Almond
I regularly eat tuna, beef and pork. Protein seems to be no problem. Corn I'm scared to try as the reactions were so severe two years ago. I have rice pasta about 4 x per week as a side. I'm mostly paleo now so I don't have white potato very often but it is no problem if I am out and order potato. Oat--I've not tried and don't think I every will. I think eating oatmeal for breakfast for 30 years contributed to me getting this disease.
It took me two years to get to remission. The big question is if I would have got to remission faster I'd stuck to chicken?
Brandy