second Enterolab results :( :( :(

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:17 pm

Hi All!

Would appreciate your comments on what's going on with me! I have been gluten soy, dairy, & egg free since my first results, from Enterolab, 2.5 years ago. I use allergen free supplements, shampoos etc.
We have no gluten in my kitchen or any other allergens. I do not eat processed foods, or grains.
I was totally blindsided by the results today.

2.5 years ago.....

Gluten/Antigenic Food Sensitivity Stool Panel
Fecal Anti-gliadin IgA 62 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-casein (cow’s milk) IgA 18 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-ovalbumin (chicken egg) IgA 21 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-soy IgA 22 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Expanded Antigenic Food Sensitivity Stool Panel
Mean Value 11 Antigenic Foods 30 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

While all of the foods tested can be immune-stimulating, the hierarchy of reactions detected were as follows:

Food to which there was no significant immunological reactivity: Food to which there was some immunological reactivity (1+): Food to which there was moderate immunological reactivity (2+): Food to which there was significant and/or the most immunological reactivity (3+):
None White potato
Cashew
Walnut
Corn
Pork
Almond
Rice
Beef
Tuna
Chicken
Oat

Within each class of foods to which you displayed multiple reactions, the hierarchy of those reactions detected were as follows:

Grains:
Grain toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Rice
Grain toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Oat
Grain toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Corn

Meats:
Meat toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Beef
Meat toward which you were next most immunologically reactive: Tuna
Meat toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Chicken
Meat toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Pork

Nuts:
Nut toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Almond
Nut toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Cashew
Nut toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Walnut

Last week:

Comprehensive Gluten/Antigenic Food Sensitivity Stool Panel

Fecal Anti-gliadin IgA 57 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-casein (cow’s milk) IgA 50 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-ovalbumin (chicken egg) IgA 49 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Fecal Anti-soy IgA 40 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

Mean Value 11 Antigenic Foods 32 Units (Normal Range is less than 10 Units)

While all of the foods tested can be immune-stimulating, the hierarchy of reactions detected were as follows:

Food to which there was no significant immunological reactivity: Food to which there was some immunological reactivity (1+): Food to which there was moderate immunological reactivity (2+): Food to which there was significant and/or the most immunological reactivity (3+):
None Rice
Corn
Oat
Chicken
Tuna
Pork
Beef
Walnut
Almond
Cashew
White potato
None

Within each class of foods to which you displayed multiple reactions, the hierarchy of those reactions detected were as follows:

Grains:
Grain toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Corn
Grain toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Oat
Grain toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Rice

Meats:
Meat toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Chicken
Meat toward which you were next most immunologically reactive: Tuna
Meat toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Pork
Meat toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Beef

Nuts:
Nut toward which you displayed the most immunologic reactivity: Walnut
Nut toward which you displayed intermediate immunologic reactivity: Almond
Nut toward which you displayed the least immunologic reactivity: Cashew

dfpowell · Post by **dfpowell** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 4:37 pm

How can you show a reaction to grains if you have not been eating them?

I also re-did the Enterolab testing a year ago, which was the 3rd time I did the tests, and my results got worse after making all of the necessary diet changes. It showed that I was reacting to foods I had not eaten in a year or more. So I do not understand how these tests work.

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 6:48 pm

I have wondered that myself, Donna!

It is interesting to hear that after making all the changes in your diet, your numbers went up, too!

I'm not alone! But, we need to get to the bottom of this.

What is causing this hyper inflamed state in our bodies for so long, and what can we do to calm it down?

dfpowell · Post by **dfpowell** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:06 pm

Linda,
I started using cholestyramine about 3 1/2 weeks ago, which started controlling my MC symptoms by the second day, and am feeling better than I have in the past several years. So for me adding a medication after exhausting all diet options was a good choice. I continue to follow GF,DF,EF,and SF.

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:38 pm

Thanks, Donna.

I am open to anything.

I want to find the cause, so I can treat that, and it will not be easy.

Do you have your gall bladder? Isn't that Polly takes? My MC symptoms are in remission, and I feel that the immune response may be tied to mast cells or a similar issue.....but, who knows! The Enterolab results blew me out of the water!

louis · Post by **louis** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:45 am

I dont have an answer for you but i can say its quite similair for me. Im strict 100% gluten-free since 5 years but in the test before a few month my Anti-gliadin was above 50 aswell. So you are definitly not the only one.

Polly · Post by **Polly** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 6:54 am

Hi Linda,

Well, that's discouraging, to say the least. In your PM you mentioned that you had a phone call in to enterolab......I will be interested to see their take on this.

It sounds like others have seen increases in antibodies, too, despite a careful diet. I had gluten retested after one year, and my value went up too (into the 50s)! They explained it by saying that there must be continued gluten contamination in my diet.

I have no clue how this can happen. I am assuming you are not eating out or taking any meds/herbs/supplements that might be contaminated. You say you have no MC symptoms, so I am wondering your reason for repeating the test? Perhaps you continue to make antibodies but your body has healed to the extent that you no longer react to them like you did initially. Actually, it is not the antibodies that make us sick - it is the antibody/antigen complex that causes the symptoms. So, maybe even though you continue to make antibodies, they are not forming complexes with the food antigens. But I really have no clue. I will try to contact Dr. Fine to get his take on this.

Yes, cholestyramine is what I take, too (same as Donna). I have never had gall bladder (GB) problems. Cholestyramine is the treatment for the chronic D that often results from GB removal; however, the majority of folks with bile acid excess do not have any underlying problems and the GB is intact.

Polly

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:06 am

Thanks for the quick response, Polly!

I do not eat any foods that I don't make myself. I haven't eaten out in over two years. My supplements are all allergen free from Freeda, Seeking Health, Thorne, or Klaire Labs.

I repeated the test because I have had such a limited diet for so long that I wanted to safely start adding a few new foods. I still have little flares that last a few days, with pencil thin stools. But, for the past few weeks I'm back to normal. My only complaint health wise is some arthritis in my thumbs, and constant nasal congestion.

It seems that my +1 foods from the first test moved up to +2 maybe because I was eating them?? My +3 foods moved down to +2 because I was not eating them??

But, my real concern is the gluten, dairy, egg, & soy.....my house is gluten and soy free. I handle eggs because we have chickens, but really that's a stretch.....

I would so be appreciative if you would be able to call Dr. Fine and get his thoughts, as I don't know what else to do.....geez....my scores were lower when I was still eating the top 4 allergens....maybe I need to go back to eating ice cream & white bread!! Just kidding, but that's how I feel.

I appreciate your time and thoughts.

Polly · Post by **Polly** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:36 am

Linda,

I wrote an email to Dr. Fine and am hoping that he will respond. Stay tuned.

Yes, I think your ideas are valid with regard to the reasons for change in the other foods.

Polly

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 7:47 am

Thank you, Polly.

Your help is much appreciated.

Post by **tex** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:02 am

Linda,

In our email exchange yesterday, I overlooked this:

Linda wrote:My only complaint health wise is some arthritis in my thumbs, and constant nasal congestion.

The arthritis is almost surely associated with a T-cell reaction (similar to MC), though prostaglandins or leukotrienes might also be involved.

The nasal congestion though, is almost surely associated with a classic allergic reaction (an IgE-based reaction), suggesting a mast cell activation issue. Have you noticed any red, itchy spots anywhere on your skin?

During the summer (suggesting that heat is an factor) I have only very minor nasal symptoms, but small scattered itchy spots are a common problem for me, especially when I am out working in very hot weather, and especially if I eat something with an elevated histamine content (such as a ripe banana). And sometimes when those itchy sites are active, I notice a little minor bloating.

At any rate, it appears that you may be dealing with more than one type of inflammation.

Tex

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:22 pm

Very interesting, Tex. I've always had seasonal allergies (pollen), some years are better than others.
I am allergic to cats, too.

I don't get itchy spots, but my skin gets itchy sometimes, and I never associated it with a higher histamine food or a little belly bloat, but I will keep that in mind. I need to look into mast cells a bit deeper, as I didn't think it was an issue for me a few years ago when I joined this site.

I talked to Kathy at Enterolab today. She is going to talk with Dr. Fine regarding my results. She felt that maybe I am producing more Iga as my system gets stronger until the body regulates itself. But, she wanted to get Fine's take on it too.

It will be interesting to get his take on this situation from both Polly and the lab.

Thank you!

Erica P-G · Post by **Erica P-G** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:28 pm

I have been pondering your results and will be interested in what everyone has to say too.

Those results were our way of helping us to stay away from offending proteins and antigens built up in our intestines. It is not fair that now we have to second guess that what we used as SAFE foods are now on the top of the Do Not Eat list until those antigens calm down...

Rotating foods....that's not gonna happen in the slim pickens food dept that we all need to do to help our gut heal. So it appears we build up antigens to even the safe things we are healing with until we can introduce a more broader menu of foods. It makes sense, but at the same time it makes me wonder if that has the potential to keep us from healing completely too, hence some of us needing a slight med intervention to complete the circuit so to speak.

I would think after 2.5 years of your diet change all would be well with the world or close to it!

I started thinking about our SAFE foods and how much we eat of them, and why they wouldn't create an antigen, our bodies are so used to being on the defense about what goes into the intestines that it doesn't surprise me that eventually it would make a case against the GOOD foods.

ldubois7 · Post by **ldubois7** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 6:24 pm

It is a unique situation that I'm in, for sure! :)

I'm waiting to hear from Dr. Fine, too. Then, I can try to digest this and move forward. :)

Lilja · Post by **Lilja** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:04 am

Erica P-G wrote: I started thinking about our SAFE foods and how much we eat of them, and why they wouldn't create an antigen, our bodies are so used to being on the defense about what goes into the intestines that it doesn't surprise me that eventually it would make a case against the GOOD foods.

Erica,

Maybe it's like you say:

The technology we have today can only detect so and so high levels of our antigens, but maybe we react to all food, and more severely than it is possible to detect with the tools that are at hand. And when starting eliminating, we concentrate on a few "safe" foods, and because of lack of variety, over time our bodies start reacting to these as well.

Just thinking out loud here.

Lilia