Hi Tex,
Yup, Tex you are dead on regarding the machines and interpretations. My scan in 2011 was done on a Dexa scan that was at a woman's health center at an average hospital kind of stuck in a closet. The scan done two weeks ago was at University of Florida Claude Pepper Institute for Aging on a real high tech piece of equipment. The technicians had quite different training. Technician of 2011 worked part time but had been in scanning for a long time and did a lot of scans. Technician at the Claude Pepper institute for Aging was a lady who was a phd researcher that they kind of skirted some laws to get her certified-- reading between the lines. She does a few scans a week. I'm guessing the first scan was read by a radiologist and the second scan I'm sure was read by some kind of PHD researcher, perhaps an M.D. but I don't think was read by a radiologist.
The Univ of Fl Claude Pepper Institute for Aging is a really, really plush research facility by the way. It is about 2 years old. A lot of money went into the facility. The doors alone must be many thousands of dollars.
Yup, I thought this would be an interesting thread plus I figured it would be a good reference for me down the road.
Next topic will be Stress and Bone Density.
Help Please, Bone Density results, somewhat surprising
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
They may have used up all their money and it will take a while before they can afford to hire a radiologist.Brandy wrote:The doors alone must be many thousands of dollars.
One of the "problems" with research projects of this sort is that all of the work is done by the named researchers, so unless one of the listed authors happens to be a radiologist, it's unlikely that a radiologist will be reviewing the data (before it's published). At least I "think" that's the SOP.
Thanks for the insight.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Hi Brandy,
Quick reply and I didn't have time the time to read the other responses so I apologize if I'm repeating something that's already been said! I too had a bone density test done last Fall (I am 48). I haven't had a period in 3 years and there was concern about the impact that might be having on my bones. My bones are about average for a 30 year old so no concerns. Do you lift weights at all? I have been lifting weights for close to 30 years and am convinced that has been what has saved my bones!
Quick reply and I didn't have time the time to read the other responses so I apologize if I'm repeating something that's already been said! I too had a bone density test done last Fall (I am 48). I haven't had a period in 3 years and there was concern about the impact that might be having on my bones. My bones are about average for a 30 year old so no concerns. Do you lift weights at all? I have been lifting weights for close to 30 years and am convinced that has been what has saved my bones!
Hi Cathy,
Yes lifting weights is key. I've been in and out of the gym for decades but I don't think I lift heavy enough weights. There are ladies 20 years older than me lifting maybe 70% more weight than I do. I'm working on increasing my weights.
Tex, yes, you are correct. The top three people in charge of the study are all researchers, PHD kind of people. I have not met them but I have their phone numbers. On first day a MD interviewed me for about 20 minutes but I don't think he is involved with the study. There is a ton of research projects going on and the MD seemed to be a floater MD to ensure I was up to doing the study in a cursory fashion.
Yes lifting weights is key. I've been in and out of the gym for decades but I don't think I lift heavy enough weights. There are ladies 20 years older than me lifting maybe 70% more weight than I do. I'm working on increasing my weights.
Tex, yes, you are correct. The top three people in charge of the study are all researchers, PHD kind of people. I have not met them but I have their phone numbers. On first day a MD interviewed me for about 20 minutes but I don't think he is involved with the study. There is a ton of research projects going on and the MD seemed to be a floater MD to ensure I was up to doing the study in a cursory fashion.
Stress Management and my plan:
After I got the results of my second Dexa scan my original plan was to ditch yoga and devote a lot of time on lifting weights. I've been doing a lot of reading and am learning that osteoporosis is linked to INFLAMMATION. There is that word again. Upon further research I learned that there is a link to stress, anxiety, depression and low bone density. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23095987, http://www.pnas.org/content/103/45/16876, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19047547. Who knew that there was such a link to stress/anxiety and depression to bone density.
I decided I needed to come up with a stress management plan to work on reducing inflammation. Here is my plan:
1. Meditation/and/or prayer 10 minutes in a.m.
2. Meditative yoga, 2x3 times per week. I find Yoga Nidra and Amrit yoga particularly meditative. I am avoiding forward bending poses which are contraindicated for people with osteoporosis.
3. Get outside support for tough ongoing family situations.
4. Get offline after dinner. No computers/electronics after dinner. Electronic use in evening affects my sleep.
5. Sleep--try for 8 hours.
6. Get outside.
7. Work on Joie de vivre and better work/life balance which is tough for Type A's.
8. Resume cooking my meals (proteins, sweet potatos etc in bulk.) Freeze the protein portions and frig the sweet potatos for meal usage. Having precooked foods really reduces my stress. I need to get back to this.
9. Massage--pricey but perhaps once a quarter
My next post will be about how I'm revising my exercise plan.
After I got the results of my second Dexa scan my original plan was to ditch yoga and devote a lot of time on lifting weights. I've been doing a lot of reading and am learning that osteoporosis is linked to INFLAMMATION. There is that word again. Upon further research I learned that there is a link to stress, anxiety, depression and low bone density. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23095987, http://www.pnas.org/content/103/45/16876, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19047547. Who knew that there was such a link to stress/anxiety and depression to bone density.
I decided I needed to come up with a stress management plan to work on reducing inflammation. Here is my plan:
1. Meditation/and/or prayer 10 minutes in a.m.
2. Meditative yoga, 2x3 times per week. I find Yoga Nidra and Amrit yoga particularly meditative. I am avoiding forward bending poses which are contraindicated for people with osteoporosis.
3. Get outside support for tough ongoing family situations.
4. Get offline after dinner. No computers/electronics after dinner. Electronic use in evening affects my sleep.
5. Sleep--try for 8 hours.
6. Get outside.
7. Work on Joie de vivre and better work/life balance which is tough for Type A's.
8. Resume cooking my meals (proteins, sweet potatos etc in bulk.) Freeze the protein portions and frig the sweet potatos for meal usage. Having precooked foods really reduces my stress. I need to get back to this.
9. Massage--pricey but perhaps once a quarter
My next post will be about how I'm revising my exercise plan.
Note that all of those symptoms are also linked to gluten sensitivity and to magnesium deficiency (which is linked to gluten sensitivity by way of malabsorption problems), both of which are probably the 2 most common causes of osteoporosis.Brandy wrote:Who knew that there was such a link to stress/anxiety and depression to bone density.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Tex, since I started taking magnesium per this board I definitely feel less stress. I'm also off of blood pressure meds. I don't know why folks with borderline high blood pressure are not put on magnesium b/f prescription drugs.
Your post prompted me to pull the glycinate bottle and check dosage. The bottle labels are very confusing and very individualistic by brand.
Your post prompted me to pull the glycinate bottle and check dosage. The bottle labels are very confusing and very individualistic by brand.
After I doubled my magnesium intake late last spring my average long-term blood pressure went down about 15–20 mmHg and it has remained there. In fact, some authorities warn about taking too much magnesium and causing BP to become too low. But the fact that no one has ever heard their doctor recommend magnesium supplements for lowering BP is clear evidence of the bias in medicine toward prescribing drugs rather than resolving vitamin and mineral deficiencies in order to treat health issues. And now I wonder if naturopathic doctors even recommend magnesium for mild to moderate hypertension. 
Tex
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Exercise:
Mom is age 82 and has osteoporosis. She does extensive walking and gets up and down a lot playing with Lucky the dog all day. I think agility and walking are key for Mom. Even with osteoporosis I think Mom is at low risk for fracture because she is so amazingly fit and agile. Dad, by contrast, has no osteoporosis but he is walking inflammation and can barely walk 100 yards and is a huge fall risk.
For me, age 55, this is what I've been studying:
Weight bearing exercises are key to maintaining bone density. These include:
jogging outside
stairclimbing
hops/jumps, http://extension.oregonstate.edu/physic ... omps-jumps , http://extension.oregonstate.edu/physic ... i_2012.pdf
weight lifting, also see http://cals.arizona.edu/cpan/files/Hout ... %20_2_.pdf
dance--shag, east coast swing, west coast swing, salsa, marengue, contra, square, zydeco
jump rope
skipping
hiking on uneven terrain
zumba
step aerobics
jogging on treadmill (not as good as outside)
weight vest--see oregon state site above, look around the Oregon State website for discussion, also see http://cals.arizona.edu/cpan/files/Hout ... %20_2_.pdf
Muscle strengthening exercises to help balance and reduce risk of falls:
pilates
yoga
general strengthening exercises, ex: those seen in Walk Tall book
tai chi-- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17466739
I've also run across these:
vibration platform--limited data on these for bone building
mini-tramp/rebounder---limited data on these for bone building, seems sketchy and more like marketing hype
During the last several weeks I've started jogging on a leaf/pine needle trail near my house, climbing stairs--I'm up to 14 flights at a time, doing some latin dancing, and starting up with machines/weight lifting. I'm doing the bone building exercises 3-4 x per week. My right knee needs a day to recover. I'm walking on the non workout days. The biggest challenge for me is trying not to overdo. I'm ramping up over a 3 month period. Both Oregon State and Arizona (see above) like the weight vests. I don't think I'm up for that yet but will probably buy something in 3 months. How the heck do you wear a weight vest in a tropical climate? I've also hit a yoga class several times but am avoiding anything involving forward bends in yoga as not good for spine. The boyfriend and I also went dancing once. I make sure we dance to all of the fast stuff.
I've picked up the Walk Tall book but have not had time to review it or try the exercises in it. These are exercises that do not use weights and anyone up to age 100 could do these exercises. They are mostly about strengthening the upper back.
I just received the Arizona book and think I'm going to have a trainer at the gym take me through the 6 machines that Arizona recommends for good form etc. I think I'll also have a trainer work with me on upper back exercises. I'm not sure if a physical therapist or trainer is better? I've had a trainer in the past but it was not tough enough of a workout. The Arizona and Oregon State regimen's are pretty strenuous but that is what it takes to maintain bone....high weights/low reps. The Oregon State has a free workout on their website see link above. I have not had time to view it. I think a disc can be purchased for $12.00 from them which is not a bad price. I like the Arizona and Oregon State resources has they have documented results of building bone.
I tried a vibration machine at the gym. I wasn't crazy about how it made my brain feel like it was in a vitamixer. The setting was on high and I could not figure out how to lower the setting. I decided to skip the vibration machines for now.
I feel a little overwhelmed by all of this and my mind is scattered. I'm feeling like I need to lock in a weekly fitness routine.
Any suggestions from you all?
My next update will be on diet and I definitely have some questions for you then.
Mom is age 82 and has osteoporosis. She does extensive walking and gets up and down a lot playing with Lucky the dog all day. I think agility and walking are key for Mom. Even with osteoporosis I think Mom is at low risk for fracture because she is so amazingly fit and agile. Dad, by contrast, has no osteoporosis but he is walking inflammation and can barely walk 100 yards and is a huge fall risk.
For me, age 55, this is what I've been studying:
Weight bearing exercises are key to maintaining bone density. These include:
jogging outside
stairclimbing
hops/jumps, http://extension.oregonstate.edu/physic ... omps-jumps , http://extension.oregonstate.edu/physic ... i_2012.pdf
weight lifting, also see http://cals.arizona.edu/cpan/files/Hout ... %20_2_.pdf
dance--shag, east coast swing, west coast swing, salsa, marengue, contra, square, zydeco
jump rope
skipping
hiking on uneven terrain
zumba
step aerobics
jogging on treadmill (not as good as outside)
weight vest--see oregon state site above, look around the Oregon State website for discussion, also see http://cals.arizona.edu/cpan/files/Hout ... %20_2_.pdf
Muscle strengthening exercises to help balance and reduce risk of falls:
pilates
yoga
general strengthening exercises, ex: those seen in Walk Tall book
tai chi-- http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17466739
I've also run across these:
vibration platform--limited data on these for bone building
mini-tramp/rebounder---limited data on these for bone building, seems sketchy and more like marketing hype
During the last several weeks I've started jogging on a leaf/pine needle trail near my house, climbing stairs--I'm up to 14 flights at a time, doing some latin dancing, and starting up with machines/weight lifting. I'm doing the bone building exercises 3-4 x per week. My right knee needs a day to recover. I'm walking on the non workout days. The biggest challenge for me is trying not to overdo. I'm ramping up over a 3 month period. Both Oregon State and Arizona (see above) like the weight vests. I don't think I'm up for that yet but will probably buy something in 3 months. How the heck do you wear a weight vest in a tropical climate? I've also hit a yoga class several times but am avoiding anything involving forward bends in yoga as not good for spine. The boyfriend and I also went dancing once. I make sure we dance to all of the fast stuff.
I've picked up the Walk Tall book but have not had time to review it or try the exercises in it. These are exercises that do not use weights and anyone up to age 100 could do these exercises. They are mostly about strengthening the upper back.
I just received the Arizona book and think I'm going to have a trainer at the gym take me through the 6 machines that Arizona recommends for good form etc. I think I'll also have a trainer work with me on upper back exercises. I'm not sure if a physical therapist or trainer is better? I've had a trainer in the past but it was not tough enough of a workout. The Arizona and Oregon State regimen's are pretty strenuous but that is what it takes to maintain bone....high weights/low reps. The Oregon State has a free workout on their website see link above. I have not had time to view it. I think a disc can be purchased for $12.00 from them which is not a bad price. I like the Arizona and Oregon State resources has they have documented results of building bone.
I tried a vibration machine at the gym. I wasn't crazy about how it made my brain feel like it was in a vitamixer. The setting was on high and I could not figure out how to lower the setting. I decided to skip the vibration machines for now.
I feel a little overwhelmed by all of this and my mind is scattered. I'm feeling like I need to lock in a weekly fitness routine.
Any suggestions from you all?
My next update will be on diet and I definitely have some questions for you then.
Following,..... as I think I need a baseline bone density done as it has been 2 years since I stopped cycling and almost a year since I changed my diet so drastically for this MC business. Nothing genetic I can relate to so don't know where I stand with osteoporosis.
To Succeed you have to Believe in something with such a passion that it becomes a Reality - Anita Roddick
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Hi Erica,
I think they like to do the baseline scans around age 55. I had to press to have baseline done at age 50 due to family history of osteoporosis. I would see what your gyn has to say. If you decide to get a scan go to a place that you will keep going to for scans for next couple of decades. Tex is right about this....having scan on same machine and if possible with same technician is key.
Tex, you were right about my UF scan being meaningless. I got an appointment with an alternative MD and he advised I have a research scan that scanned my whole body. The reports are not "apples to apples." I need to get the standard ladies health dexa. I've called my gyn and am getting scheduled for that. Of course the last machine that was used broke down and would be $10,000 to repair so they did not repair so I have to go to another place for scan and it will be on same type of machine but not original machine.
The alternative MD is very interesting. My girlfriend who is a big walker, around age 67, and osteoporosis reluctantly just went on Fosomax. She has been talking to random ladies for the last several years that she runs into at the grocery store and if they are around her age and small build she asks them what they are doing for their bone health and how is their bone health. The responses have not been positive. She met one lady in the checkout line at Publix however who had been on Fosomax for 5 years with no change in density and then went to this alternative MD and her bone density is turning around.
Anyways, the alternative MD is age 70, he trained as a radiation oncologist and practiced as a traditional family physician for decades. He was chief of a local hospital that got absorbed by the Shands/UF system. Here is the rest of his bio and then he WENT ROGUE and started practicing alternative medicine:
I'm feeling a little more positive about things. I still want to post to this thread about my diet and supplements for bone health so I will post that when I get a little more time.
I think they like to do the baseline scans around age 55. I had to press to have baseline done at age 50 due to family history of osteoporosis. I would see what your gyn has to say. If you decide to get a scan go to a place that you will keep going to for scans for next couple of decades. Tex is right about this....having scan on same machine and if possible with same technician is key.
Tex, you were right about my UF scan being meaningless. I got an appointment with an alternative MD and he advised I have a research scan that scanned my whole body. The reports are not "apples to apples." I need to get the standard ladies health dexa. I've called my gyn and am getting scheduled for that. Of course the last machine that was used broke down and would be $10,000 to repair so they did not repair so I have to go to another place for scan and it will be on same type of machine but not original machine.
The alternative MD is very interesting. My girlfriend who is a big walker, around age 67, and osteoporosis reluctantly just went on Fosomax. She has been talking to random ladies for the last several years that she runs into at the grocery store and if they are around her age and small build she asks them what they are doing for their bone health and how is their bone health. The responses have not been positive. She met one lady in the checkout line at Publix however who had been on Fosomax for 5 years with no change in density and then went to this alternative MD and her bone density is turning around.
Anyways, the alternative MD is age 70, he trained as a radiation oncologist and practiced as a traditional family physician for decades. He was chief of a local hospital that got absorbed by the Shands/UF system. Here is the rest of his bio and then he WENT ROGUE and started practicing alternative medicine:
He will treat thyroid by symptoms if need be per his website. Due to my family history I think I'm going to go through his program which will run around $800.00. I'm due for bloodwork and it sounds like it is extensive. My PCP never runs the extensive thyroid tests even when I ask. The alternative Md doesn't specialize in bone health but he has good results and about 90% of his bone health patients show improvement. I'm not sure if show improvement means maintaining existing density or improving it somewhat but hey I'll take either.He has served as Chief of Medicine at Alachua General Hospital. In 1995 he took a break from private practice to pursue business interests, travel, spend time with his family, and engage in integrative medical research. In March 2000 he re-entered private practice and opened the doors to the Preventive Medicine Center of Gainesville, Inc..
I'm feeling a little more positive about things. I still want to post to this thread about my diet and supplements for bone health so I will post that when I get a little more time.
Thanks Brandy :-)
The next time I feel up to doing a Wellbeing visit (just because I am not ready to explain my life away to another new Dr. yet) I will pose the question, see what happens. I should be able to stick with the same bldg. and machine in my area.
cheers
E
The next time I feel up to doing a Wellbeing visit (just because I am not ready to explain my life away to another new Dr. yet) I will pose the question, see what happens. I should be able to stick with the same bldg. and machine in my area.
cheers
E
To Succeed you have to Believe in something with such a passion that it becomes a Reality - Anita Roddick
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
brandy wrote:Stress Management and my plan:
I decided I needed to come up with a stress management plan to work on reducing inflammation. Here is my plan:
1. Meditation/and/or prayer 10 minutes in a.m.
2. Meditative yoga, 2x3 times per week. I find Yoga Nidra and Amrit yoga particularly meditative. I am avoiding forward bending poses which are contraindicated for people with osteoporosis.
3. Get outside support for tough ongoing family situations.
4. Get offline after dinner. No computers/electronics after dinner. Electronic use in evening affects my sleep.
5. Sleep--try for 8 hours.
6. Get outside.
7. Work on Joie de vivre and better work/life balance which is tough for Type A's.
8. Resume cooking my meals (proteins, sweet potatos etc in bulk.) Freeze the protein portions and frig the sweet potatos for meal usage. Having precooked foods really reduces my stress. I need to get back to this.
9. Massage--pricey but perhaps once a quarter
My next post will be about how I'm revising my exercise plan.
I think your ideas sound terrific! I recently started doing heated Vinyasa Yoga 7 weeks ago once or twice a week and absolutely love it as a stress reducer and it has helped my flexibility. I also have to say that a weekly or bi-weekly massage is key to both stress relief and back/neck pain since a car accident last Fall. You are definitely on the right track!
Brandy,
The useful information in this thread continues to get better and better.
Thanks for all the information and insight.
Tex
The useful information in this thread continues to get better and better.
Thanks for all the information and insight.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.