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tex
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Post by tex »

Brandy wrote:Supplements are tough on us. I think sometimes they are too concentrated. They can be contaminated. I think the little pellets going through are gut are just tough to digest.
Brandy wrote:Example in my life. I can't tolerate tumeric/curcumin or ginger as supplements but I can tolerate them in foods as a spice. I think the supplement form is too concentrated for me to digest.
:iagree: This is a very good point. The human digestive system was designed to get nutrition from whole food, where nutrients are available in groups. In many cases, the combinations of nutrients may offer synergistic effects that are not available in concentrated supplements. Humans evolved eating real food for over 2 million years. When food laboratories came along, some researchers decided to make an arbitrary assumption that if food was nutritious for human health, then the nutrients in food were the most important parts of food and isolating them and using them as supplements should be even better than eating whole food. At least that was the gist of the sales pitch that the food chemistry divisions of food manufacturers and pharmaceutical companies sold to the medical community and the general public when they realized that there was a fortune waiting to be made by exploiting that idea. And everyone fell for it. :grin:

But in the real world, eating real food provides far better long-term health than trying to get nutrition out of a bottle. The digestive system can extract nutrients from real food much more efficiently that from concentrated supplements. This is the reason why when supplements are taken, the "doses" have to be so much larger than the amount of nutrients provided by real foods. And what happens to all those excess nutrients that are not absorbed from the supplements? They have to be removed from circulation by the liver or kidneys and purged from the system, often overloading these organs because they were not designed to do that on a full-time basis. I'm not saying that supplements are always bad — when they are the only option, then they are obviously better than nothing. But they should not be viewed as a primary source of nutrition in the long run unless the digestive system is permanently compromised to a degree that food is no longer a reliable source of complete nutrition. Whenever possible, getting nutritional needs from food is far superior to taking supplements.

That said, there are a couple of exceptions to that general rule. Vitamin B-12 and folic acid seem to be absorbed more efficiently from the right type of supplements than from whole food, especially by individuals who have methylation issues.

GAC's post brought to mind the fact that I forgot to mention something in my earlier responses. According to Chris Kressor (holistic medicine practitioner), magnesium deficiency is often misdiagnosed as fibromyalgia. And magnesium deficiency has been shown by researchers to be associated with asthma, and magnesium affects the severity of asthma symptoms (symptoms are much worse when magnesium is deficient). Yes, magnesium can cause the same aches and pains as fibro. Antibiotics also deplete magnesium. And about a year ago when my magnesium deficiency finally became severe (after repeated antibiotic treatments for dental work), I would often have symptoms that seemed just like asthma, except that there was no wheezing. I hadn't had asthma for almost 50 years, but when I was a kid I had severe asthma problems, so I'm familiar with the symptoms. So now I wonder if I might have been magnesium deficient when I was a kid.

Tex
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Post by Gabes-Apg »

Tex
i did mention that point in my first reply to Becky
I am similar age group and like you, have multiple health issues. Long story short, i resolved the fibromyalgia issues mostly with fixing major magnesium deficiency. ( i use the spray /lotion)
for me, years of health issues and medications that deplete magnesium, it took high doses 800mg plus elemental magnesium per day for a few months to resolve my magnesium deficiency. Once i did this majority of the fibromyalgia symptoms abated. they only seem to return if I reduce magnesium intake.

and for my combo of health issues, years of methylation cycle issues, and key nutrient deficiencies (magnesium, Vit D, zinc etc) explain my life long health issues.
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Post by Adelaide »

Medical experts have long suspected that MC may be caused by adverse gut bacteria populations, but no one has ever discovered or defined the mechanism by which this happens. I believe that I have figured out how it works, but I need to do some more research to verify my theory.
I definitely know that is what happened to me Tex. I had a perfect functioning gut but after taking antibiotics and not eating for 4 days I am absolutely positive the antibiotics killed all the good bacteria. Symptoms started days after taking those antibiotics. I have had tests which showed I now have dysbiosis. I look forward to reading your new book :grin:
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Post by Bketler1 »

I guess I should have specified that the Naturopath wanted me to quit dairy and beef but at the time I was not willing to stop the dairy but I did reduce my beef intake considerably. I went off of both for over a month but the results weren't enough at that time to make me take notice and want to continue. I don't recall why she put me on probiotics since it's been so long ago but the positive side effect for me was no more of the occ soft stools that I got when I ate beef so I continued them.

I think I am going to try a protein shake and an apple for breakfast instead of the oatmeal. I have been a creature of habit for so long I don't really know what else to do. I have such limited time in the morning so that will have to do for now. I truly have very little variety in my diet. I eat and drink the exact same things all the time. Coffee, tea, water and the occ Vitamin Water. I am ditching Vitamin Water b/c of the amount of sugar & chemicals. I've already found some electrolyte replacement alternatives. I use Agave in my coffee and stevia now and then. I use coconut milk coffee creamer. I don't drink Almond Milk or anything, I don't care for the taste so not many sources of calcium for me. I eat chicken and spinach or asparagus or green beans or broccoli for lunch and dinner. Sometimes steak instead. Sometimes a salad w/ chicken. Occ Tuna. Occ a burger, no bread. Sometimes fruit, apple, blueberries, mandarin oranges, strawberries. Rare occ a bologna sandwich. Sometimes I'll get chicken wings/naked.

I was actually told by my doc to take the cholestyramine on an as needed kind of basis so that's why I didn't have a specific regimen I was following. Immodium in the past I have taken up to four in a 4-6 hour period of time when following the bottle instructions and still shown no improvement whatsoever. Since the bottle says not to take more than that in a 24 hour period I never thought to try more. Pepto has never helped it at all either. The only thing it occ helps with is my gastritis. I guess I could try it and see how it goes.
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Post by Bketler1 »

I wish there was a like button for the posts here lol
:smile:
Becky

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Post by Gabes-Apg »

Becky many here are on a bland restrictive diet, and for some of us, it is a for life thing.

I have been eating the same 5 vegetables and safe proteins for the past 6 years or more.
rice protein with coconut water, black coffee , water.

thats it.

i have some sometimes foods that i can have 1-2 serves a week on good weeks.
cooked fruit in small serve maybe once every few months
it is what i have to do to minimise inflammation and optimise wellness.

and there are remote tribes in various areas of the world that have been eating on a base of small amount of ingredients for hundreds of years. and of note, these people do not have auto immune conditions, or gut issues like developed countries..
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Post by Bketler1 »

Yea, I don't have a problem with a restricted diet, I already eat pretty restricted. I am just struggling with the change from dropping oatmeal and the fact that I need to ditch the salads and limit my fruit. It seems as though I'll be eating even less than I already do. It'll be fine, I can manage. I'm just a creature of habit lol. The limited diet is why I'm worried about stopping the supplements. Oh well, it is what it is, I'm in now lol.

I'm going to start weaning off some of the supplements this week so I can get this ball rolling. I need to get out of the bathroom. I don't have time to be sick. This is so frustrating. My fear is that I'll never truly reach remission b/c of all my prescriptions and constant need for some sort of antibiotic therapy. I have constant sinus infections and uti's. I can usually treat them holistically but sometimes they require antibiotics. I am in need of sinus surgery I have been putting off, I need knee surgery and dental work. I know antibiotics are in my future so wish me luck!

Let the journey begin!!!
:grin:
Becky

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Post by Bketler1 »

Wow, I just looked at the TD magnesium and I'd have to use a lot of sprays .... kinda scary for someone with Aquagenic Pruritis :sad:
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Post by tex »

Becky,

TBH, with your likely dosage needs, (and offset by the pruritus) I would be surprised if you will be able to derive much benefit from topical magnesium applications.

Incidentally, I don't see D-mannose on your list. It's arguably the best/safest way to prevent/treat UTIs and a few members have found it to be helpful for suppressing some of the MC inflammation, also.

I'm concerned about your meds possibly preventing remission also, but if you can get rid of the worst offenders, and truly get your diet under control, you've got a good chance of success. If it turns out to be close, but no cigar, you may be able to take up the slack with a maintenance dose of budesonide (assuming that budesonide will be effective for you after you get your diet ducks in a row).

Tex
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Post by tex »

Incidentally, I trust that you are planning to peel and nuke that breakfast apple so as to minimize the fiber and make it easier to digest.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by Bketler1 »

I have D- Mannose, that I use to treat an active infection. I use the cranberry daily to keep them to a minimum. I, for some reason with my 3 kidneys, am prone to bladder and kidney infections. I woke up with one beginning this morning actually. I don't know if it's b/c of the kidney surgery I had when I was 8 or what but I have fought infections my whole life. I didn't want to stay on antibiotics my whole life so when my Naturopath gave me the U-Tract I was delighted. I took it a step further by adding a daily cranberry supplement b/c I was going through so much U-Tract. That has done the trick with keeping the infections down a good bit as well as the fact that I know most triggers.

I didn't list quite a few things I keep in my arsenal for flare ups of various sorts. I use several Hyland's sublinguals. I use stinging nettle for itch flare ups. I have colloidal silver, the D- mannose.... My grandmother was way before her time when it came to eating healthy, diet and supplements. She had a lot of health issues as well as was not expected to live into her 30's. She made it long enough to see most of her great grand children born. My mother is almost as much of a mess as me lol. She manages a lot of her issues with diet too that's why the diet isn't foreign to me, its just a matter of buckling down. The oatmeal being the biggest hurdle.

I assume I can just make batches of cooked apples with a few spices?

And do you think I should continue my digestive enzymes? I take those with every meal. I can ditch them if you think I should. I skipped the magnesium last night and woke up in the middle of the night with a foot cramp so until the new one comes from Pure Encapsulations I'll have to keep it up with the crappy oxide version.

I'm buying your book this weekend so hopefully that will cut down on all the questions lol
:pigtail:
Becky

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Post by tex »

A lot of people seem to like cinnamon on baked or nuked apples.

You're in the same position that I was in with magnesium deficiency for years. If I skipped magnesium, it would show up the next night as foot/leg cramps. But since I was taking what I thought was more than the RDA, it never occurred to me that I needed more, I thought that I must surely be short on some other electrolyte — until a magnesium deficiency showed up on a blood test because I didn't take my magnesium supplement that morning before the blood draw. I have no doubt that if I had taken a supplement that morning, the test results would have been right in the middle of the normal range. Because magnesium is a critical electrolyte, the body is always going to keep the blood level in the normal range, unless there is absolutely no magnesium left in storage anywhere in muscle tissue from which magnesium can be drawn.

The problem was the misleading labeling practice followed by so many magnesium manufacturers where they list the "serving size" dose on the front label (but not a word about serving size) and then on the back label, where it can be easily overlooked, they list the "serving size" as 2 tablets. For years I was taking half as much magnesium as I thought I was, and it has taken roughly a year to get rid of that chronic deficiency.

I'm the wrong one to ask about digestive enzymes. Back when I was recovering, and doing well, I decided that I would do even better and heal faster if I followed the "experts'" advice to take a digestive enzyme supplement. So I bought an expensive combination of digestive enzymes that promised to allow me to digest the kitchen sink if I should have a craving to eat it. I took the first capsule before breakfast, and within about 2 hours my stomach was screaming at me about how gullible I was to waste my money on a product that seemed to have all the benefits of a combination of lye and arsenic. About half an hour later, just before the pain reached the totally intolerable point, the projectile vomiting began. After it was over, it was such a relief to get all that nuclear waste out of my stomach that I felt pretty good again.

But after about half an hour, things headed south again, and for the rest of the day and up into the night, about every 2 hours or so I went through the process again and again. Of course after the second event there was nothing left in my stomach, so I enjoyed session after session of dry heaves. The next day my stomach felt as if it were on fire, but later in the day I was able to keep a little chicken soup down. By the fourth day the burning in my guts had subsided enough that I finally got up the nerve to try some solid food again.

So that's why I'm not the best source of information on whether or not to use any digestive enzymes. :lol: Some members here seem to tolerate them OK, and some even insist that they help. But I can personally attest that they aren't beneficial for everyone. After that experience, I wouldn't touch one with a 10-foot pole. :lol: If you're sure that they are helpful, they probably are. If you aren't sure that they are helping, they probably are not.

I agree that if you haven't got any good magnesium supplement on hand, magnesium oxide is better than nothing. :grin:

Tex
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Post by Bketler1 »

That sounds awful Tex! I don't blame you one bit for avoiding enzymes like the plague! lol
They seem to help me so for now I'll let them hang out but they may be one of the first to go whenever I get myself squared away.

I'm not gonna lie, this past weekend all I did was cry. I'm usually pretty tough and I've been through a lot of health setbacks over the years but this ranks almost as high as the dialysis. I am headed to the grocery store now with a partial list of things to pick up. I guess I'm going to pick up some potatoes. I haven't eaten them except once or twice a year over the last few years so my produce guy is going to give me a look I'm sure lol.

Hope everyone has a good evening and I'm praying for just one less trip to the throne each day :wink:
Becky

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Post by Erica P-G »

Soaking the feet in Epsom salts is a fine way to get some good magnesium into our cells when we don't have anything in the cupboard yet :-)

I use Lifeflo Magnesium oil and lotion...they work great and I can put the lotion on my feet right before bed and that helps with cramps and it makes my feet soft :smile: I put the oil on my legs in the mornings and leave it on a half hour while I get my self ready for work, then I lightly wipe the white residue off before putting clothes on.

I'm also taking 5000mg VitD3 morning and night since I just learned I only increased my VitD level two points 43 last year to 45 this year, so that tells me I am using every bit of VitD3 I am inputting into my body and I need considerably more. My Dr. told me to take my 5000mg twice daily for at least the next 8 months possibly until my next well being visit when we revisit VitD levels again.

I was going along great guns until the pollen season hit, that took me down a notch or two, wasn't taking my usual Allegra antihistamine, but I'm back on it now!!...so don't feel bad, MC is a process.

Progress...not perfection :wink:
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Post by tex »

Becky wrote:I'm not gonna lie, this past weekend all I did was cry.
Please don't feel like the Lone Ranger. Believe it or not, that's another undocumented (at least it's undocumented by the medical profession) side effect of MC. Once I got past my childhood, I never cried. Never. When I was in my late 50s, my symptoms began, and the disease reprogrammed a lot of things about me. Now I can get all misty-eyed at the drop of a hat.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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