Early last year I reached remission by eating a very limited number of foods: bacon, banana, cod, white rice, chicken soup (homemade). I began supplements: Vitamin D3 and magnesium. I've mentioned here that I've been in a flare for some months. I believe I may be eating a trigger (chicken?), and am going to eliminate that food, although it will be difficult giving up one of my staples.
Here's my question: every once in a while I get frustrated and cheat -- never gluten, dairy or egg, but I'll have guacamole with my chicken and rice, or today, a chocolate chip cookie lara bar after lunch, and lo and behold, things in the bathroom seem a little bit better. Obviously, in the case of guacamole, I know I shouldn't be eating raw veggies, but my system seems to grant me a little bit of temporary forgiveness: a 6 or 5 where my system empties out and I have a nice flat stomach. I would expect the opposite. Now, this doesn't happen 100% of the time, but enough that I'm left scratching my head at how to decipher these results. Any guess as to what's going on? I've been GF, EF, DF and mostly SF (except for infrequent lara bar), for well over a year...almost 18 months.
By the way, by flare, I am in the bathroom maybe 4x a day with 7's. Not much urgency if I remain on the limited diet, but I'm failing to add any new foods or reach remission again. Any ideas? I need a new point of view...I'm desperate to add the B's to my diet because I know I have a mast cell issue.
Also, as a reminder, I tried cholestyramine with not great results which had led me to believe I am still running up against a trigger :/ Thanks to both of you for helping me decipher my issues!
Mary
diet question for Tex or Gabes
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8330
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
hi mary
I have seen some people where a once was safe staple, is no longer safe. and over time more people are reacting to chicken - i think is because of what they feed the chicken
it might be worth trying something like turkey or the meat from animals that flourish from being grass fed, like lamb, bison, venison etc.
as you are aware of the mast cell issues it is a good reason to start the active B's now.
of note my mast cell issues came AFTER a colonscopy that stated my MC was in remission. (about 2 years after my initial Dx)
keeping in mind that histamine/mast cell issues is just as likely to be due to external triggers not always food ingredients
for me, my eating plan is pretty much my stage 2 staples, due to my combo of health issues (inflammation levels and very slow healing process) I have not been able to add in ingredients or expand the eating plan. so I have been eating the same ingredients for almost 7 years. (safe animal proteins and my 5-6 safe veges always well cooked) and I have a few 'sometimes foods' that I can have small serves of when I am feeling well.
of note, if i have something like small serve of dairy, I dont get any gut issues. It impacts my adrenals and nervous system.
hope this helps
I have seen some people where a once was safe staple, is no longer safe. and over time more people are reacting to chicken - i think is because of what they feed the chicken
it might be worth trying something like turkey or the meat from animals that flourish from being grass fed, like lamb, bison, venison etc.
as you are aware of the mast cell issues it is a good reason to start the active B's now.
of note my mast cell issues came AFTER a colonscopy that stated my MC was in remission. (about 2 years after my initial Dx)
keeping in mind that histamine/mast cell issues is just as likely to be due to external triggers not always food ingredients
for me, my eating plan is pretty much my stage 2 staples, due to my combo of health issues (inflammation levels and very slow healing process) I have not been able to add in ingredients or expand the eating plan. so I have been eating the same ingredients for almost 7 years. (safe animal proteins and my 5-6 safe veges always well cooked) and I have a few 'sometimes foods' that I can have small serves of when I am feeling well.
of note, if i have something like small serve of dairy, I dont get any gut issues. It impacts my adrenals and nervous system.
hope this helps
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
Hi Mary,
You have the right idea. If you're ever inclined to cheat, never cheat on gluten, because the half-life of anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies is 120 days. That means that a few minutes of indiscretion results in months of increased inflammation. The half-life of most other antibodies, by comparison, is only about 6 days. And cheating on fiber has the least amount of extended influence. It may result in an adverse reaction, but fiber does not provoke the immune system to produce any antibodies.
It's natural to want to reintroduce foods. Unfortunately it takes a lot longer for the gut to heal than almost everyone realizes — typically 2 to 3 years for most adults, and some cases take longer. Kids heal much faster — usually in less than a year. Like you, a month or so after I achieved remission I tried to reintroduce corn into my diet. And even though it didn't work, every month or so I would try again.
I had no idea that healing would take so long. I was finally successful in reintroducing corn into my diet about a year and a half after reaching remission on the elimination diet.
When I was initially testing foods (before I began my elimination diet — back in those days I had never heard of an elimination diet), I kept a very detailed diary, and like you I noticed that sometimes I reacted to certain foods, and sometimes I didn't. And sometimes I seemed to react to anything and everything. But after I had been gluten-free long enough that my anti-gliadin antibody level was beginning to decline a bit (3–4 months), it began to be easier to be able to make sense of the effects of other foods in my diet. Because of the long half-life of anti-gliadin antibodies, they dominate the immune system as long as the level is relatively high. As that level declines, then the immune system is once again able to focus on other reactions. IOW, until our immune system recovers somewhat from the overpowering effects of gluten, it can be almost impossible to make sense of reaction symptoms.
The main problem with trying to reintroduce foods too soon (besides the inconvenience of a possible reaction) is that every failure bumps the inflammation level up a bit, which extends the recovery time.
This is just a guess, but I would surmise that the reason why daring to try a food and not having an adverse reaction has such a gratifying effect is because it's similar to a placebo effect — we really want it to work and so it does work. It works because it has a very calming effect on stress levels. Stress promotes inflammation, and the absence of stress helps to resolve inflammation.
At least that's how I see it. I hope I haven't just confused the issue.
Tex
You have the right idea. If you're ever inclined to cheat, never cheat on gluten, because the half-life of anti-gliadin (anti-gluten) antibodies is 120 days. That means that a few minutes of indiscretion results in months of increased inflammation. The half-life of most other antibodies, by comparison, is only about 6 days. And cheating on fiber has the least amount of extended influence. It may result in an adverse reaction, but fiber does not provoke the immune system to produce any antibodies.
It's natural to want to reintroduce foods. Unfortunately it takes a lot longer for the gut to heal than almost everyone realizes — typically 2 to 3 years for most adults, and some cases take longer. Kids heal much faster — usually in less than a year. Like you, a month or so after I achieved remission I tried to reintroduce corn into my diet. And even though it didn't work, every month or so I would try again.
I had no idea that healing would take so long. I was finally successful in reintroducing corn into my diet about a year and a half after reaching remission on the elimination diet.When I was initially testing foods (before I began my elimination diet — back in those days I had never heard of an elimination diet), I kept a very detailed diary, and like you I noticed that sometimes I reacted to certain foods, and sometimes I didn't. And sometimes I seemed to react to anything and everything. But after I had been gluten-free long enough that my anti-gliadin antibody level was beginning to decline a bit (3–4 months), it began to be easier to be able to make sense of the effects of other foods in my diet. Because of the long half-life of anti-gliadin antibodies, they dominate the immune system as long as the level is relatively high. As that level declines, then the immune system is once again able to focus on other reactions. IOW, until our immune system recovers somewhat from the overpowering effects of gluten, it can be almost impossible to make sense of reaction symptoms.
The main problem with trying to reintroduce foods too soon (besides the inconvenience of a possible reaction) is that every failure bumps the inflammation level up a bit, which extends the recovery time.
This is just a guess, but I would surmise that the reason why daring to try a food and not having an adverse reaction has such a gratifying effect is because it's similar to a placebo effect — we really want it to work and so it does work. It works because it has a very calming effect on stress levels. Stress promotes inflammation, and the absence of stress helps to resolve inflammation.
At least that's how I see it. I hope I haven't just confused the issue.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thanks to both of you.
Yes, Tex, I can see the placebo effect at work and after all this time, I have to agree with you. I appreciate your analysis. Not many people understand the question, let alone know how to answer that one.
Gabes, I'm going to take your advice and begin the B's. I've asked the makers of the patch about soy...no response yet, but I intend to go that route and hope for the best. I've been at this long enough that I'm beginning to worry about supplements.
I've been browsing this forum for so long now, and based on all I've read and learned, I think that along with diet, time is the best healer. It helps to read posts from way back and know that there are so many names and faces who have moved on, I hope and assume it's because they've found wellness. Thanks again to both of you for being here for those of us who are new or in-between. I'm not sure where I'd be if it were not for this space.
Mary
Yes, Tex, I can see the placebo effect at work and after all this time, I have to agree with you. I appreciate your analysis. Not many people understand the question, let alone know how to answer that one.
Gabes, I'm going to take your advice and begin the B's. I've asked the makers of the patch about soy...no response yet, but I intend to go that route and hope for the best. I've been at this long enough that I'm beginning to worry about supplements.
I've been browsing this forum for so long now, and based on all I've read and learned, I think that along with diet, time is the best healer. It helps to read posts from way back and know that there are so many names and faces who have moved on, I hope and assume it's because they've found wellness. Thanks again to both of you for being here for those of us who are new or in-between. I'm not sure where I'd be if it were not for this space.
Mary
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8330
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
Mary
in the discussion about the patches someone confirmed they were soy free, and i think someone got them and have started to use them with no issues...
with mastcell/histamine issues - active B6 = P5P would be a priority...
in the discussion about the patches someone confirmed they were soy free, and i think someone got them and have started to use them with no issues...
with mastcell/histamine issues - active B6 = P5P would be a priority...
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama