Hi,
Been awhile. Been doing well and have been in remission from MC for a few years now and lastest Celiac endoscope showed no damage...yay! I did have my gallbladder removed back in Sept., 2015 and expected D afterwards but got sluggish instead...who would have thunk it! I did then increase my fiber which helped but if I overdo it, I get one bout of D the following morning.
I just found out I'm in menopause (ugh) and doc wants me on HRT. He has prescribed an estrogen cream called Divigil. I don't belong to any Celiac forums (haven't really found a good one) so I wanted to direct this question to the many intellects on here...especially Tex! Should I worry about gluten in the cream since it doesn't pass through my digestive system? I don't react to topical gluten. The cream does of course get into the bloodstream so was just curious on this. Hopefully I'll get on the pellet implant therapy and won't have to worry about it. I feel like I'm asking a stupid question...that I should know this but I wanted to be 100% sure. Haven't seen my GI doctor in ages...suppose I could call him if I wanted but thought I'd try here first.
Thanks so much,
Terri
Can't believe I'm asking this question!
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Can't believe I'm asking this question!
Diagnosed with Lymphocytic Colitis in July, 2012 then with Celiac in November, 2012.
HI Terri,
I am 49 and just went thru menopause...yes my genes predisposed me to early onset.
I would not do the HRT, it caused me to flare, I researched it...too many issues with contaminants Gluten, and Soy being a big one. I increased my VitD3 and really increased my Magnesium and my body has loved me very much for approaching the big M naturally. Which we can do and I have been able to stay away from those Heated sweats that people scare you about....mind you I did have them Pre-MC and my doctor put me on an estrogen patch (which had soy) and Progesterone cream (it had soy too..sigh) but alas I made it thru great after learning so much here about having super low Mag levels and how increasing them could help me in so many ways including the estrogen support.
My Dr. even went as far as to tell me that if I didn't take the extra estrogen therapy did I want to get Older faster
I have been so put out by that comment that I stopped seeing him. I have been Big M for 2 years now...and really once one has gone thru a year without a cycle you are not in menopause any longer you have become Post menopause 
Anyway you do what you feel is right for your body, I do know that keeping the VitD, Mag, Zinc, VitC and any B's up I've done a really great job getting thru to the other side of that journey, naturally.
Good Luck!
Erica
I am 49 and just went thru menopause...yes my genes predisposed me to early onset.
I would not do the HRT, it caused me to flare, I researched it...too many issues with contaminants Gluten, and Soy being a big one. I increased my VitD3 and really increased my Magnesium and my body has loved me very much for approaching the big M naturally. Which we can do and I have been able to stay away from those Heated sweats that people scare you about....mind you I did have them Pre-MC and my doctor put me on an estrogen patch (which had soy) and Progesterone cream (it had soy too..sigh) but alas I made it thru great after learning so much here about having super low Mag levels and how increasing them could help me in so many ways including the estrogen support.
My Dr. even went as far as to tell me that if I didn't take the extra estrogen therapy did I want to get Older faster
I have been so put out by that comment that I stopped seeing him. I have been Big M for 2 years now...and really once one has gone thru a year without a cycle you are not in menopause any longer you have become Post menopause Anyway you do what you feel is right for your body, I do know that keeping the VitD, Mag, Zinc, VitC and any B's up I've done a really great job getting thru to the other side of that journey, naturally.
Good Luck!
Erica
To Succeed you have to Believe in something with such a passion that it becomes a Reality - Anita Roddick
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Hello Terri,
It's good to see an update from you and to learn that you've been doing well and your digestive system has healed well.
Regarding your question, it's possible that some of us might be able to get away with skin contact of items such as gluten and soy, but for most of us, commercial products designed to be absorbed through the skin are as risky as Vanessa and Erica have noted. The problem is not so much the gluten or soy, as the way it is administered. For example, I grew wheat for many years, and you can't harvest and store wheat without getting plenty of it on your skin because of the ever-present grain dust. And until a few years ago, I owned a seed cleaning facility where we cleaned (among many other grains) wheat seed/grain. I was always careful not to get it in my mouth, lick my lips, or do anything else that might cause ingestion. I wore a dust mask, but of course that only excludes about 99 % or so of the dust. I never had a problem with doing any of that because, as the experts point out, gluten molecules are too large to be absorbed through the skin (under normal conditions).
But when we use gluten-containing commercially processed products that have gone through no telling how many chemical processes, it's a whole new ballgame and the rules are changed. And this is why virtually all medical professions misinterpret this problem. They simply don't understand why the rules are changed. The rules are changed because (and this is strictly my opinion) some of the chemical processing breaks down the gluten molecules into the same highly-reactive peptides that occur when we run wheat through our digestive system.
Still, that wouldn't necessarily guarantee that our skin would allow those peptides to pass through, because it's designed to keep such things out. Unfortunately the pharmaceutical companies (in their infinite wisdom) defeat that protective mechanism by adding chemical penetration enhancers (CPEs) to virtually all products designed to be absorbed through the skin. CPEs do just what their name implies — they enhance the absorption of the product, by opening up the pores in the skin. CPEs create the same degree of increased permeability in the skin that leaky gut causes in our intestines. IOW, CPEs cause "leaky gut" of the skin, and this allows any highly reactive peptides from gluten, soy, or whatever, to be absorbed through the skin and into the bloodstream.
Please be aware that this is strictly my theory, and it has not been either verified or ruled out by scientific research, but I'm reasonably certain that this is the mechanism by which ingredients to which we are sensitive manage to pass through our skin to cause us to react.
IMO Erica is right on target. I agree that the night sweats associated with menopause are almost certainly caused by a magnesium deficiency induced by the hormonal changes associated with menopause. A similar issue occurs during pregnancy. Morning sickness is caused by the hormonal changes induced by pregnancy that result in a massive drain of magnesium reserves. The nausea is a symptom of magnesium deficiency. Expectant mothers who boost their magnesium reserves by loading up on magnesium prior to or early on during pregnancy either do not have morning sickness or it's only a minor problem for them.
Likewise, I'm convinced that the night sweats associated with menopause are due to an acute magnesium deficiency. 2 years ago when my chronic magnesium deficiency suddenly became severe after using an antibiotic (that dramatically depletes magnesium) I had night sweats that wouldn't stop. At first I thought that I had the flu, but when they kept returning, night after night, week after week, it finally dawned on me that something else was obviously wrong. And yes, dramatically boosting my magnesium supplementation quickly resolved the problem. Who would have thought that such a simple mineral could cause so many problems if we run short of it — certainly not the medical community.
But please be aware that for many women, HRT (even without gluten, soy, or any other antigen) can prevent remission from MC, regardless of how it's administered, by virtue of the fact that certain hormonal changes can trigger digestive system issues. So if you decide to try HRT and find that you can't tolerate the treatments, reach for the magnesium. It's a simple, cheap remedy, but it just works.
I hope that some of this is helpful.
Tex
It's good to see an update from you and to learn that you've been doing well and your digestive system has healed well.
Regarding your question, it's possible that some of us might be able to get away with skin contact of items such as gluten and soy, but for most of us, commercial products designed to be absorbed through the skin are as risky as Vanessa and Erica have noted. The problem is not so much the gluten or soy, as the way it is administered. For example, I grew wheat for many years, and you can't harvest and store wheat without getting plenty of it on your skin because of the ever-present grain dust. And until a few years ago, I owned a seed cleaning facility where we cleaned (among many other grains) wheat seed/grain. I was always careful not to get it in my mouth, lick my lips, or do anything else that might cause ingestion. I wore a dust mask, but of course that only excludes about 99 % or so of the dust. I never had a problem with doing any of that because, as the experts point out, gluten molecules are too large to be absorbed through the skin (under normal conditions).
But when we use gluten-containing commercially processed products that have gone through no telling how many chemical processes, it's a whole new ballgame and the rules are changed. And this is why virtually all medical professions misinterpret this problem. They simply don't understand why the rules are changed. The rules are changed because (and this is strictly my opinion) some of the chemical processing breaks down the gluten molecules into the same highly-reactive peptides that occur when we run wheat through our digestive system.
Still, that wouldn't necessarily guarantee that our skin would allow those peptides to pass through, because it's designed to keep such things out. Unfortunately the pharmaceutical companies (in their infinite wisdom) defeat that protective mechanism by adding chemical penetration enhancers (CPEs) to virtually all products designed to be absorbed through the skin. CPEs do just what their name implies — they enhance the absorption of the product, by opening up the pores in the skin. CPEs create the same degree of increased permeability in the skin that leaky gut causes in our intestines. IOW, CPEs cause "leaky gut" of the skin, and this allows any highly reactive peptides from gluten, soy, or whatever, to be absorbed through the skin and into the bloodstream.
Please be aware that this is strictly my theory, and it has not been either verified or ruled out by scientific research, but I'm reasonably certain that this is the mechanism by which ingredients to which we are sensitive manage to pass through our skin to cause us to react.
IMO Erica is right on target. I agree that the night sweats associated with menopause are almost certainly caused by a magnesium deficiency induced by the hormonal changes associated with menopause. A similar issue occurs during pregnancy. Morning sickness is caused by the hormonal changes induced by pregnancy that result in a massive drain of magnesium reserves. The nausea is a symptom of magnesium deficiency. Expectant mothers who boost their magnesium reserves by loading up on magnesium prior to or early on during pregnancy either do not have morning sickness or it's only a minor problem for them.
Likewise, I'm convinced that the night sweats associated with menopause are due to an acute magnesium deficiency. 2 years ago when my chronic magnesium deficiency suddenly became severe after using an antibiotic (that dramatically depletes magnesium) I had night sweats that wouldn't stop. At first I thought that I had the flu, but when they kept returning, night after night, week after week, it finally dawned on me that something else was obviously wrong. And yes, dramatically boosting my magnesium supplementation quickly resolved the problem. Who would have thought that such a simple mineral could cause so many problems if we run short of it — certainly not the medical community.
But please be aware that for many women, HRT (even without gluten, soy, or any other antigen) can prevent remission from MC, regardless of how it's administered, by virtue of the fact that certain hormonal changes can trigger digestive system issues. So if you decide to try HRT and find that you can't tolerate the treatments, reach for the magnesium. It's a simple, cheap remedy, but it just works.
I hope that some of this is helpful.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thanks so much for your responses! I'm overwhelmed. I feel awful...tired, brain fog, headaches (only when off my birth control pill), nervousness...but no hot flashes and only the occasional night sweat. The progesterone is gluten free and soy free but still unsure of the estrogen cream as I have not heard back from the manufacturer. Soy is in the DIM pill I have to take if I do pellet therapy...estrogen and testosterone are put under the skin and there is no gluten/soy in that. I do worry about another flare with taking a new progesterone and now this DIM capsule but I've never had issues with soy so hoping I get lucky.
I would have never thought that about Magnesium...I have been super scared to try it as I'm afraid it will result in D again. I do have the lotion tho but never knew if it worked or not. And it's super thick and hard to apply. My doctor acts like to protect my heart and bones, I need these hormones as my bloodwork showed pretty much non-existent levels. My doctor sounds just like yours Erica! But I'm so tired of feeling bad...tho I feel better when I'm on my birth control pills. I have never reacted to my birth control. What kind of Magnesium do you take? There is no doubt I'm low on it. But that's more than likely to put me in a flare than HRT I think. I guess I can try the pellet therapy for 3 months (that's how long it lasts) and then stop if it bothers me after 3 months. Such a big decision to make.
Tex...thanks so much for all your knowledge. You still blow my mind with it. Very interesting. Yes, I'm worried about the hormones changes as well but since I've been on the pill for so many years, maybe I won't have any issues since my levels will be constant with the pellet therapy. I will definitely pass on the estrogen cream...no call back from the manufacturer likely means they don't know.
Wonder if Magnesium works for libido as well. Thanks again to you all! And let me know what kind of magnesium you all take. Lotion, gel, pill? What kind of magnesium?
Oh and by the way...gallbladder surgery left me with the side effect of GERD and I've had to take Zantac daily on and off for awhile...I'm guessing that has lowered my magnesium as well. And Tex, I had to take antibiotics in August..didn't react but like you said I'm guessing it didn't help my Mag levels either...I did not know about that.
Love,
Terri
I would have never thought that about Magnesium...I have been super scared to try it as I'm afraid it will result in D again. I do have the lotion tho but never knew if it worked or not. And it's super thick and hard to apply. My doctor acts like to protect my heart and bones, I need these hormones as my bloodwork showed pretty much non-existent levels. My doctor sounds just like yours Erica! But I'm so tired of feeling bad...tho I feel better when I'm on my birth control pills. I have never reacted to my birth control. What kind of Magnesium do you take? There is no doubt I'm low on it. But that's more than likely to put me in a flare than HRT I think. I guess I can try the pellet therapy for 3 months (that's how long it lasts) and then stop if it bothers me after 3 months. Such a big decision to make.
Tex...thanks so much for all your knowledge. You still blow my mind with it. Very interesting. Yes, I'm worried about the hormones changes as well but since I've been on the pill for so many years, maybe I won't have any issues since my levels will be constant with the pellet therapy. I will definitely pass on the estrogen cream...no call back from the manufacturer likely means they don't know.
Wonder if Magnesium works for libido as well. Thanks again to you all! And let me know what kind of magnesium you all take. Lotion, gel, pill? What kind of magnesium?
Oh and by the way...gallbladder surgery left me with the side effect of GERD and I've had to take Zantac daily on and off for awhile...I'm guessing that has lowered my magnesium as well. And Tex, I had to take antibiotics in August..didn't react but like you said I'm guessing it didn't help my Mag levels either...I did not know about that.
Love,
Terri
Diagnosed with Lymphocytic Colitis in July, 2012 then with Celiac in November, 2012.
Yes it does, as a matter of fact. A chronic magnesium deficiency has been shown to cause insulin resistance, and insulin resistance causes loss of libido. So resolving a magnesium deficiency can boost/restore libido.Terri wrote:Wonder if Magnesium works for libido as well.
Most of us use either chelated magnesium (magnesium glycinate) as oral tablets, or magnesium oil or lotion as a topical application. Many use a combination. Magnesium glycinate is the form that's the least likely to cause diarrhea in larger doses.
And yes, PPIs, H2 blockers, and antacids interfere with the absorption of magnesium, and so do many antibiotics.
You're very welcome.
Love,
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
-
Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8332
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
Further to the suggestions above, things like Zinc and B6 (P5P being the active form of B6) are also important for hormone regulation amongst other things.
long story short
lifelong deficiency of B6 and zinc meant that i never menstruated as teenager, and never had any sort of regular cycle as an adult.
now age 47, that i have resolved ALOT of nutrient deficiencies like magnesium, zinc, B6 etc, I am having a regular cycle every 30 days, healthy cycle.
the other option is using compounded progesterone cream (no gluten or soy etc) I have seen this provide benefit to both MC'er and non MC'ers
there is lots of good info on natural options to support your body during menopause and not have impact on MC.
long story short
lifelong deficiency of B6 and zinc meant that i never menstruated as teenager, and never had any sort of regular cycle as an adult.
now age 47, that i have resolved ALOT of nutrient deficiencies like magnesium, zinc, B6 etc, I am having a regular cycle every 30 days, healthy cycle.
the other option is using compounded progesterone cream (no gluten or soy etc) I have seen this provide benefit to both MC'er and non MC'ers
there is lots of good info on natural options to support your body during menopause and not have impact on MC.
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
thanks so much Tex! And good to hear from you Gabes. I now remember how knowledgeable you are on Magnesium. I was taking the Ancient Minerals Mag. cream but stopped it...wasn't sure it was working and it stunk a little. Erica did tell me to get some from Vitacost.com..I think. Will try the oil this time.
Interesting about Zinc and B6 tho Erica did mention that to me too. Interesting about your cycles. May I ask how much zinc and B6 you take...I have some in my vitamin gummies but not sure if it's enough. 150% of B6 and 17% of zinc. And where to you buy your vitamins...online? Do you buy a bottle of zinc and one of B6. It's just so hard to find out what's gluten free or not and if I don't have to research it all, I'll be happy.
I will mention to my doc about the compounded progesterone cream but I fear it's going to be super expensive. If I do have any issues tho, it will be from the progesterone pill...I did find out the DIM pill is soy free too. I start my pellet implants on Friday....wish me luck. At least I now know of another route I can take if I have issues. this is probably something I don't want to do for too long.
Thanks so much for the information.
Terri
Interesting about Zinc and B6 tho Erica did mention that to me too. Interesting about your cycles. May I ask how much zinc and B6 you take...I have some in my vitamin gummies but not sure if it's enough. 150% of B6 and 17% of zinc. And where to you buy your vitamins...online? Do you buy a bottle of zinc and one of B6. It's just so hard to find out what's gluten free or not and if I don't have to research it all, I'll be happy.
I will mention to my doc about the compounded progesterone cream but I fear it's going to be super expensive. If I do have any issues tho, it will be from the progesterone pill...I did find out the DIM pill is soy free too. I start my pellet implants on Friday....wish me luck. At least I now know of another route I can take if I have issues. this is probably something I don't want to do for too long.
Thanks so much for the information.
Terri
Diagnosed with Lymphocytic Colitis in July, 2012 then with Celiac in November, 2012.
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8332
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
I am in Australia - albeit i purchase quite alot of my supplements from iHerb
iHerb has great product information (ie what the product has and doesnt have ingredient wise) Now Foods and Thorne Research are two brands that I use alot of. they use rice flour as the filler.
Zinc - Now foods or Thorne research Zinc picolinate is good option (now foods is cheaper)
P5P (active form of B6 and much much better for multitude of reasons) the Thorne research P5P is very good product
I am now taking Thorne -Methyl Guard Plus product (P5P, active B9, and active B12)
with the symptoms and issues you are having you would want at least 30mg- 50mg of zinc per day. I would not take more than this unless you have had your zinc and copper blood levels checked.
In regards to the P5P - 40-50mg of P5P (if you have the recommended dose of the Thorne product being 3 capsules per day then you will be getting this quantity)
***I have heredity ongoing health condition that causes Zinc and B6 deficiencies so my dosages are not relevant to others unless they are have had testing done in line with this health issue
for the small outlay to get a different magnesium oil or topical mag product it is sooo worth it (cheaper than having long term health issues)
if you get magnesium oil (rather than cream), you can dilute it with demineralised water. the other option is doing a foot soak or bath in epsom salts every day. if you use at least a cup of epsom salts this will give you a 200-300mg elemental magnesium per day.
Also - if taking medications depletes key nutrients and we have to take additional supplements to counteract that - how is that saving money?
iHerb has great product information (ie what the product has and doesnt have ingredient wise) Now Foods and Thorne Research are two brands that I use alot of. they use rice flour as the filler.
Zinc - Now foods or Thorne research Zinc picolinate is good option (now foods is cheaper)
P5P (active form of B6 and much much better for multitude of reasons) the Thorne research P5P is very good product
I am now taking Thorne -Methyl Guard Plus product (P5P, active B9, and active B12)
with the symptoms and issues you are having you would want at least 30mg- 50mg of zinc per day. I would not take more than this unless you have had your zinc and copper blood levels checked.
In regards to the P5P - 40-50mg of P5P (if you have the recommended dose of the Thorne product being 3 capsules per day then you will be getting this quantity)
***I have heredity ongoing health condition that causes Zinc and B6 deficiencies so my dosages are not relevant to others unless they are have had testing done in line with this health issue
for the small outlay to get a different magnesium oil or topical mag product it is sooo worth it (cheaper than having long term health issues)
if you get magnesium oil (rather than cream), you can dilute it with demineralised water. the other option is doing a foot soak or bath in epsom salts every day. if you use at least a cup of epsom salts this will give you a 200-300mg elemental magnesium per day.
It might 'seem' more expensive but if using it means a) you dont have any MC issues and b) you are not having menapause symptoms and can enjoy life a bit better, isnt that worth a bit of an outlay?I will mention to my doc about the compounded progesterone cream but I fear it's going to be super expensive.
Also - if taking medications depletes key nutrients and we have to take additional supplements to counteract that - how is that saving money?
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama