Has anyone developed MC after a neck/back injury? I am working with a new chiropractor, and after describing all my crazy symptoms and pain, he immediately asked me about my car accident in '95. He is convinced my vagus nerve was damaged/impeded from the severe whiplash I had and has resulted in most all of my following conditions. I know they are attributing some cases of Ulcerative Colitis, Chron's, and Rheumatoid Arthritis to vagus nerve disorders, so I'm wondering if it's plausible with our condition too.
Within 4 years of the accident, I was diagnosed with infertility, collagenous colitis, GERD, and I lost my sense of smell (along with the back and neck pain). In 2006, I moved away from my previous chiro, and my symptoms started exacerbating with more pain (bursa and nerve), gaining weight, chronic fatigue, brain fog and weird episodes of head and neck pressure, rapid heart beat, and an overall feeling of anxiety to the point that sometimes I think I'm going to faint or have a heart attack. I have to sleep a little while to get over it. Of course, all tests over the years have shown normal results, except my CC biopsies in 1999.
I have always assumed that my daily Advil use after my accident caused my CC, but I do wonder if Dr. Fine ever studied what pain turned us to NSAIDS in the first place. Or, what is different about us that led to our problems with NSAIDS. I'm very curious to know if a neck/back injury (or any type of trauma to the body really) precursored your battle too. Wayne, have you found anything in your research to suggest this could be a contributing factor?
Vagus Nerve Disorders or Neck/Back Injury
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
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Jeannie101010
- Posts: 4
- Joined: Mon May 13, 2013 6:42 pm
Hi Jeannie,
I haven't come across any published research data on this topic, but yes, damage to the enteric nervous system can certainly disrupt digestive system functioning, which can lead to virtually any type of autoimmune diseases and other health issues. NSAIDs are so commonly prescribed to treat so many different issues that accurately attributing the reasons for treatment would be difficult. The problem is that vagus nerve damage is such a small percentage of the typical reasons why NSAIDs are prescribed that this use would almost surely be lost in the shuffle (dominated by all the other reasons).
But have you considered other possible reasons why your symptoms are so severe? The severity may be due to multiple causes. In addition to the vagus nerve damage, you may be hyperthyroid. The symptoms you list (except for weight gain) are typically associated with hyperthyroidism. And many of those symptoms (again, except for weight gain) are associated with chronic magnesium deficiency. I can verify that from personal experience. I'm not suggesting that vagus nerve damage is not the primary cause of your symptoms, I'm just pointing out that the symptoms may be made much worse by other possible issues.
Magnesium deficiency is endemic with IBDs, but like gluten sensitivity, most of us seriously doubt that we have a chronic magnesium deficiency until we see the difference after we correct our deficiency. Note that a chronic magnesium deficiency can cause nerve damage, or cause existing nerve damage to become worse.
FWIW, my lifelong use of NSAIDs was extremely limited, so it's not likely that they had anything to do with the onset of my symptoms.
Regarding lab tests . . . the serum magnesium test typically ordered by doctors is worthless. It will show normal levels of magnesium until the body is virtually devoid of all magnesium because magnesium is a vital electrolyte so its blood level is automatically regulated within a relatively narrow "normal" range. Ask for an RBC (Red Blood Cell) magnesium test. The RBC magnesium test will give a much better estimate of the magnesium level in the body. But note that the listed "normal" range for the test results is wrong because those data were based on subjects 80 % of whom had a chronic magnesium deficiency. A correct normal range for the RBC magnesium test is 6.0–6.5. The lab test results you receive will incorrectly show a lower "normal" range. For a reference, Dr. Carolyn Dean explains the details in her book, and on her website.
Few things are more misleading than lab tests that are based on incorrect "normal" ranges, and this is one of the serious (and persistent) problems within the health care system. The TSH test used to assess thyroid issues is another example of "normal range" issues due to data based on a test population that was biased toward hypothyroidism.
Tex
I haven't come across any published research data on this topic, but yes, damage to the enteric nervous system can certainly disrupt digestive system functioning, which can lead to virtually any type of autoimmune diseases and other health issues. NSAIDs are so commonly prescribed to treat so many different issues that accurately attributing the reasons for treatment would be difficult. The problem is that vagus nerve damage is such a small percentage of the typical reasons why NSAIDs are prescribed that this use would almost surely be lost in the shuffle (dominated by all the other reasons).
But have you considered other possible reasons why your symptoms are so severe? The severity may be due to multiple causes. In addition to the vagus nerve damage, you may be hyperthyroid. The symptoms you list (except for weight gain) are typically associated with hyperthyroidism. And many of those symptoms (again, except for weight gain) are associated with chronic magnesium deficiency. I can verify that from personal experience. I'm not suggesting that vagus nerve damage is not the primary cause of your symptoms, I'm just pointing out that the symptoms may be made much worse by other possible issues.
Magnesium deficiency is endemic with IBDs, but like gluten sensitivity, most of us seriously doubt that we have a chronic magnesium deficiency until we see the difference after we correct our deficiency. Note that a chronic magnesium deficiency can cause nerve damage, or cause existing nerve damage to become worse.
FWIW, my lifelong use of NSAIDs was extremely limited, so it's not likely that they had anything to do with the onset of my symptoms.
Regarding lab tests . . . the serum magnesium test typically ordered by doctors is worthless. It will show normal levels of magnesium until the body is virtually devoid of all magnesium because magnesium is a vital electrolyte so its blood level is automatically regulated within a relatively narrow "normal" range. Ask for an RBC (Red Blood Cell) magnesium test. The RBC magnesium test will give a much better estimate of the magnesium level in the body. But note that the listed "normal" range for the test results is wrong because those data were based on subjects 80 % of whom had a chronic magnesium deficiency. A correct normal range for the RBC magnesium test is 6.0–6.5. The lab test results you receive will incorrectly show a lower "normal" range. For a reference, Dr. Carolyn Dean explains the details in her book, and on her website.
Few things are more misleading than lab tests that are based on incorrect "normal" ranges, and this is one of the serious (and persistent) problems within the health care system. The TSH test used to assess thyroid issues is another example of "normal range" issues due to data based on a test population that was biased toward hypothyroidism.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 8332
- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
I agree that neck/spine inflammation can be linked to MC.
More so that leaky gut (which can happen without MC) allows toxins to get into the blood stream and these toxins cause inflammation in the myelin, the coating around nerves in the spinal cord.
I have been seeing a very proactive chiropractor/kinesiologist for the past 16 months - here and there we have been treating vagus nerve.
For me, things like anesthetic (for dental work) causes major inflammation on the myelin or when I have had contact with excess toxins.
(and I am in managed protocol to clear excess copper and other toxic metals)
Inflammation is inflammation - ongoing excess inflammation whereever it is in the body is root cause of 90% of modern day health issues.
It depletes key nutrients, it puts strain on immune system and adrenals, and of course has big impact on gut and effective digestion/absorption of nutrients.
this is why i so strongly encourage everybody to stick with low inflammation eating plan for the long term. we cant avoid all triggers, but minimising inflammation from what we eat /drink is best way to minimise inflammation issues.
More so that leaky gut (which can happen without MC) allows toxins to get into the blood stream and these toxins cause inflammation in the myelin, the coating around nerves in the spinal cord.
I have been seeing a very proactive chiropractor/kinesiologist for the past 16 months - here and there we have been treating vagus nerve.
For me, things like anesthetic (for dental work) causes major inflammation on the myelin or when I have had contact with excess toxins.
(and I am in managed protocol to clear excess copper and other toxic metals)
Inflammation is inflammation - ongoing excess inflammation whereever it is in the body is root cause of 90% of modern day health issues.
It depletes key nutrients, it puts strain on immune system and adrenals, and of course has big impact on gut and effective digestion/absorption of nutrients.
this is why i so strongly encourage everybody to stick with low inflammation eating plan for the long term. we cant avoid all triggers, but minimising inflammation from what we eat /drink is best way to minimise inflammation issues.
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
Re: Vagus Nerve Disorders or Neck/Back Injury
Have you heard of Atlas Profilax treatment?Jeannie101010 wrote:Has anyone developed MC after a neck/back injury? I am working with a new chiropractor, and after describing all my crazy symptoms and pain, he immediately asked me about my car accident in '95. He is convinced my vagus nerve was damaged/impeded from the severe whiplash I had and has resulted in most all of my following conditions. I know they are attributing some cases of Ulcerative Colitis, Chron's, and Rheumatoid Arthritis to vagus nerve disorders, so I'm wondering if it's plausible with our condition too.
Within 4 years of the accident, I was diagnosed with infertility, collagenous colitis, GERD, and I lost my sense of smell (along with the back and neck pain). In 2006, I moved away from my previous chiro, and my symptoms started exacerbating with more pain (bursa and nerve), gaining weight, chronic fatigue, brain fog and weird episodes of head and neck pressure, rapid heart beat, and an overall feeling of anxiety to the point that sometimes I think I'm going to faint or have a heart attack. I have to sleep a little while to get over it. Of course, all tests over the years have shown normal results, except my CC biopsies in 1999.
I have always assumed that my daily Advil use after my accident caused my CC, but I do wonder if Dr. Fine ever studied what pain turned us to NSAIDS in the first place. Or, what is different about us that led to our problems with NSAIDS. I'm very curious to know if a neck/back injury (or any type of trauma to the body really) precursored your battle too. Wayne, have you found anything in your research to suggest this could be a contributing factor?
https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/Atlas% ... BsK9_9GIcb
Lilja
Collagenous Colitis diagnosis in 2010
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013
Hi
You people are far too polite
It turns out that the enclosed link above does not work, and nobody has reacted.
I try to resend the link, hopefully this one does work.
https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/Atlas% ... CoyoEFzOtQ
You people are far too polite
It turns out that the enclosed link above does not work, and nobody has reacted.
I try to resend the link, hopefully this one does work.
https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/Atlas% ... CoyoEFzOtQ
Collagenous Colitis diagnosis in 2010
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013
Hi Jeannie,
I hardly used NSAIDs during my life and I am 49 and I still ended up with LC...I'm a pretty natural person so unless i have to take a med I usually shy away from it. How I ended up with LC I suspect is diet and stress....period.
HI Lilja,
your link takes me to a facebook login, is that what it is supposed to do?
Thanks
E
I hardly used NSAIDs during my life and I am 49 and I still ended up with LC...I'm a pretty natural person so unless i have to take a med I usually shy away from it. How I ended up with LC I suspect is diet and stress....period.
HI Lilja,
your link takes me to a facebook login, is that what it is supposed to do?
Thanks
E
To Succeed you have to Believe in something with such a passion that it becomes a Reality - Anita Roddick
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
Dx LC April 2012 had symptoms since Aug 2007
I was taking a lot of ibuprofen for back pain before I developed LC. I do link the two and avoid NSAID'S as much as possible. The inflammation I was experiencing wasn't from food sensitivities or deficiencies however. I had spinal stenosis and facet disease and some misaligned discs and a back fracture, so the nerve was compressed, which is what caused the inflammation. I have since undergone back surgery and the enlarged spaces decompressed the nerve and I no longer have sciatic pain. I can successfully take ultram without having problems with LC. Though it's very hard to figure out what caused LC, for me I believe it was a combination of the nsaid use, stress, poor diet, and a weakened immune system. I also likely had a gluetin sensitivity since my symptoms improved once I started monitoring that. It is so very hard to know which came first.
I had leg weakness, which was contributed to a magnesium deficit that improved with topical spray, but which my GI doctor recommend I stop using because it can cause diarrhea. Though I can't be sure if it was the spray because I had added magnesium supplements by then. In hindsight some of that leg pain was from the back condition. My symptoms improved once I stopped that part of my management program, but it's hard to say how much of it could have been from the cessation and how much of it was from the other changes I had made. Discontinuing magnesium supplements was the last thing I had to do.
I also was menopausal and on HRT. My symptoms improved once I stopped those, too.
My symptoms also improved one I stopped taking Celexa, used to treat depression.
I had improvement when I stopped all of the herb and vitamin supplements I was taking as well. I now only take calcium and vitamin D.
Though most people lose weight with LC, I gained weight. The weight gain, which at the highest point was 148lbs with is considered overweight for someone 5' tall and whose normal weight was 115-125 created a lot of the problems I now have, or at least made ones that had gone unnoticed surface. I'm now on treatment for diabetes, which was present at the time of LC diagnoses, but was overlooked on my lab work for nearly a year though the test results showed a sugar of 148. Had I known I was dealing with diabetes from the beginning I may have had to alter the diet I used, successfully, to treat LC. That diet required high carbs and the diabetic diet requires low carbs. The one common food for both diagnosis is protein. It is very difficult for me to manage both of these conditions and know what to eat. My weight is down to 136 now after just a couple of months of low carb, and I haven't had an LC relapse, though I certainly fear it. My hope that it won't return is because of the advice I followed here that allowed my colon to rest, heal, and the slow addition of foods that I now need to eat.
I've also been diagnosed with sleep apnea, which goes hand in hand with the weight gain. Treating that has increased my energy level, too. So, I have a plethora of illnesses that I didn't have before LC, or did I have them and just wasn't diagnosed?
LC is a very difficult disease and hard to treat. I am grateful to have reached remission in just a few months instead of years and I contribute that success to following such great advice I received here though I had to tweak a few things because of other illnesses. I'd like to be able to take magnesium, for instance, but I'm too sensitive for it.
I had leg weakness, which was contributed to a magnesium deficit that improved with topical spray, but which my GI doctor recommend I stop using because it can cause diarrhea. Though I can't be sure if it was the spray because I had added magnesium supplements by then. In hindsight some of that leg pain was from the back condition. My symptoms improved once I stopped that part of my management program, but it's hard to say how much of it could have been from the cessation and how much of it was from the other changes I had made. Discontinuing magnesium supplements was the last thing I had to do.
I also was menopausal and on HRT. My symptoms improved once I stopped those, too.
My symptoms also improved one I stopped taking Celexa, used to treat depression.
I had improvement when I stopped all of the herb and vitamin supplements I was taking as well. I now only take calcium and vitamin D.
Though most people lose weight with LC, I gained weight. The weight gain, which at the highest point was 148lbs with is considered overweight for someone 5' tall and whose normal weight was 115-125 created a lot of the problems I now have, or at least made ones that had gone unnoticed surface. I'm now on treatment for diabetes, which was present at the time of LC diagnoses, but was overlooked on my lab work for nearly a year though the test results showed a sugar of 148. Had I known I was dealing with diabetes from the beginning I may have had to alter the diet I used, successfully, to treat LC. That diet required high carbs and the diabetic diet requires low carbs. The one common food for both diagnosis is protein. It is very difficult for me to manage both of these conditions and know what to eat. My weight is down to 136 now after just a couple of months of low carb, and I haven't had an LC relapse, though I certainly fear it. My hope that it won't return is because of the advice I followed here that allowed my colon to rest, heal, and the slow addition of foods that I now need to eat.
I've also been diagnosed with sleep apnea, which goes hand in hand with the weight gain. Treating that has increased my energy level, too. So, I have a plethora of illnesses that I didn't have before LC, or did I have them and just wasn't diagnosed?
LC is a very difficult disease and hard to treat. I am grateful to have reached remission in just a few months instead of years and I contribute that success to following such great advice I received here though I had to tweak a few things because of other illnesses. I'd like to be able to take magnesium, for instance, but I'm too sensitive for it.
Hi Erica,Erica P-G wrote:Hi Jeannie,
I hardly used NSAIDs during my life and I am 49 and I still ended up with LC...I'm a pretty natural person so unless i have to take a med I usually shy away from it. How I ended up with LC I suspect is diet and stress....period.
HI Lilja,
your link takes me to a facebook login, is that what it is supposed to do?
Thanks
E
I'm sorry. I haven't been on the board for a while. Here is a video :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jajcvFOH6m0
and a link:
http://www.atlasprofilax.ch/en/directory/
Lilja
Collagenous Colitis diagnosis in 2010
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013
Psoriasis in 1973, symptom free in 2014
GF, CF and SF free since April, 2013