Epsom Salt Baths - how much?

[jbrohlr]

Hello all,

The last few weeks I have been increasing my topical magnesium intake. I take two epsom salt baths a day, morning and evening before bed (3-4 cups of salt in the bath). Also, several times during the day I will use the Ancient Minerals oil spray on my legs and belly. I'm beginning to think that I'm overdoing it. I've been having muscle weakness lately and some diarrhea sporadically (fine for a couple of days then a day with 2 or 3 watery stools and borborbyglia).

Any thoughts or shared experiences on this would be appreciated.

John R.

[Gabes-Apg]

2 baths a day plus the topical may be a bit much.
Keep in mind that one of the functions of magnesium is to help the body clear toxins, so when the body has enough magnesium it will do that and that can also be the contributor to softer motions

one bath a day (2 cups max) and the topical application should be enough to gain enough magnesium

[jbrohlr]

Thank you Gabes. I'll cut back on the baths. I'm also saving up for another Enterolab test just to make sure the problem is not something I'm ingesting - still on stage one diet though.

John R.

[jbrohlr]

Well I cut back on the Magnesium, but my current troubles have turned out to be a flare. 24 hours of constant WD so far, and this time I have had to get up at night several times with WD.

I have ordered an Enterolab kit to see if I have been getting cross contamination somehow, so these questions are probably premature.

Can stress alone kick you out of remission? My job has become a source of constant frustration - I dread going in every morning. Grief might be a factor as well; I have lost many family and friends these last few years and I find myself dwelling on that often (usually when I'm at work).

Also, since stress causes a mast cell increase (if I understand correctly) will an antihistamine be an effective treatment for a stress related flare?

Today is day one of a two weeks long vacation. I'm hoping that two weeks is long enough to calm down from a stressful situation. If I do recover and/or Enterolabs shows a decrease in my antigen levels, I think I'll find other work. It's a shame if I have to quit since this used to be a good engineering firm to work for and I only have a few more years to retirement, but I am not going to compromise my health (I am still not convinced that MC is not a fatal disease considering the fatigue and massive weight loss I've encountered).

Thanks
John R.

[Gabes-Apg]

Stress has been and still is one of my major triggers

I react to emotional, physical or mental stress
another aspect is that if I have a high adrenalin day. ( I did a rally drive course on the weekend there was nerves before hand and adrenalin high at the end), the next day my gut reacts.

while you are on vacation - spend time outdoors each day, doing deep breathing or relaxing type activities, walking, gardening etc

download some podcasts or audiobooks about relaxation. these are handy as you can play them during lunch break at work to reset the mind a bit on a bad day or as you drive to work to get into the right mindset for the day ahead
(I have used these resources for 10 years. it is the main thing that has supported me mentally/emotionally to have the focus to work full time)

antihistamine may assist

one of the challenges of life with MC is that as we age and things change, so does our body. We have tweak adjust the MC management plan as time goes along. what worked 5 years ago may not work as well now.
The mental/emotional aspect of this is being ok with the variables BUT not overthinking or allow it to consume us/ get us down.

hope this helps

[Marcia K]

Good morning. Good advice from Gabes to cut back on the baths. A few years ago when I had the flu I overdid it with the Epsom salt baths & my stool because very soft.

[jbrohlr]

Thank you Marcia. I did cut back but it looks more and more like the stress at work is the culprit. The last day at work before my vacation I was up all that night with diarrhea. I improved over my vacation and then today, my first day back to work I am up late again with constant bathroom visits. Don't think it is a coincidence - my diet and supplement routine has not changed in almost a year.

I sent off my Enterolab sample this morning, but I think the writing is on the wall in what is causing my current inflammation.

I believe Tex is right when he said "stress trumps everything".

John R.

[jbrohlr]

Oh yes, thank you Gabes for your reply. I took your advice and I believe it worked to calm down my gut.

Unfortunately, every day at work is a bad day - it's become chronic.

John R.

[Marcia K]

Hi, John. I'm sorry about your work stress & I totally understand. I retired 7 months before I planned to because I decided the every day stress was killing me & it was no longer worth it. Fortunately I was able to get insurance through my husband or I would not have been able to do so. I no longer have a diagnosis of insomnia. It took 1.5 years after I retired. The effects of constant stress are long-lasting. I wish you the best.

[jbrohlr]

Well, I got my latest Enterolab results today and I am baffled:

dated May 9, 2023 (previous test was March 2022, 1 year and 2 months ago)

Fecal Anti-gliadin IgA 28 Units (March 2022 it was 28 Units), so no change

Fecal Anti-casein IgA 24 Units (March 2022 it was 10 Units), up by 14 Units

Fecal Anti-ovalbumin IgA 144 Units (March 2022 it was 116 Units), up by 28 Units

Fecal Anti-Soy IgA 12 Units (March 2022 it was 13 Units), down by 1 Unit

Mean Value 11 Antigenic Foods 42 Units (Mar 2022 it was 28 Units), up by 14 Units

Food to which there was no significant immunological reactivity: Pork, Tuna (March 2022 it was just Corn)
Food to which there was some immunological reactivity (1+): None (March 2022 it was Rice, Tuna, White Potato)
Food to which there was moderate immunological reactivity (2+): Rice, Corn, Chicken, Cashew, Walnut (March 2022 it was Chicken, Pork, Cashew, Almond)
Food to which there was significant and/or most immunological reactivity (3+): Oat, Beef, Almond, White Potato (March 2022 it was Oat, Beef, Walnut)

Quantitative Microscopic Fecal Fat Score 1267 Units !!! (did not get a Fecal Fat Score previously)

This is very confusing. There could have been a couple of cross-contamination incidents when eating at my sister's place - she cooked my safe foods but used her utensils and pots. I had a disastrous rice trial last Fall (6 months ago) so I can see my "11 Antigenic Foods" number going up. Dairy and eggs however are a complete mystery to me.

Otherwise, I have been (I thought) very strict with my diet and hygiene. Lamb (cuts and ground), ground turkey and sweet potatoes have been my diet (other than the rice and corn-on-the-cob last Fall and one try with green beans last Summer). I use Ivory Soap, Mg lotion for skin, and a little antibacterial liquid soap to clean my backside after BMs. I brush my teeth with Bentonite Clay. I don't even lick envelopes.

As far as medications; I am taking Cholestyramine. I've taken Tylenol on two occasions - once 2 months ago (bronchitis) and once 2 days ago for headache (a week after my lab test samples were sent). Supplements are D3 (Dr's Best), Epsom Salts soaks and sometimes Potassium Gluconate (non-gmo/gluten free).

The "Fecal Fat Score" does match my current symptoms - my weight loss continues, I'm getting more emaciated, and my stool is watery and yellow once or twice a day. I can have normal BM days occasionally - two or three days in a row.

Another odd thing is that Pork went down to "no significant reactivity" when last year it was in the +2 category. Tuna went to 0 as well- before it was in the +1 category. I have not eaten those foods.

So if anyone has any insight as to where I can go from here it would be greatly appreciated.

John R.

[jbrohlr]

I did not have anything to do at work this afternoon, so I did some sleuthing on this site.

So, it is likely that if I have a reaction to a gluten cross-contamination my other antibodies (for diary, eggs, etc.) will go up - even without exposure to those other proteins. That would make sense it seems since my immune system is already on alert for those proteins.

I am also wondering about stress. Can stress keep the antibody numbers up, or even raise them?

John R.

[Erica P-G]

Hi John,
Jumping in here as someone who will flare within hours after feeling stressful or allowing emotions to remain high even if the stress is for small periods of time...but I understand this about myself so I try to compensate by making sure I stay home or will by near a bathroom after the fact.

I've been on the healing journey for 8 years now, I think I have gotten my personal and professional life balanced to a point but it's still not perfect. hope your healing gets better soon, those numerous bathroom trips at night completely wear a person out! This would be an area I'd focus on and perhaps take a benedryl at night, don't drink before going to bed and stay away from electronics for a small period before going to bed. Keep a lightly cool room (not uncomfortable), it may be helpful to have a fan on low as a kind of calm sound as well. An App may work well with this calm noise as well.

I'd dig deep into your foods or products used daily, as you are definitely getting cross contaminated and that is alarming! I've learned that I really should not keep trying to go out to our local eatery (husband treat) because I end up with sore joints and brain fog, (glutened eating plain food without even trying )

Wishing you healing
Erica

[tex]

Hello John,

I have to agree with Erica, stress is a biggie, and it can override our careful planning. And yes, as you have discovered, regular, or semi-regular cross-contamination tends to increase the sensitivity of our immune system. The scores on those Enterolab results tend to increase if our exposure to an allergen continues. In other words, the longer we are exposed on a somewhat regular basis, the higher our test result will be.

But stress can also increase those scores, because it can increase the sensitivity of our immune system. And since these are uncharted waters (that is, we have no research data to go by) it's possible that stress may be solely responsible for your increased scores. Except for the fecal fat score. That may be a confounding item, because as far as I'm aware, only severe damage to the villi of your small intestine, due to gluten sensitivity, can cause a fecal fat score in that high range. In other words, the problem may indeed be diet cross-contamination with gluten.

Tex

[jbrohlr]

Thank you Erica and Tex.

As far as stress is concerned, I gave my notice at work last week and tomorrow (Fri, May 12) is my last day. I knew it had to be done when last month I took a two week vacation and tangibly improved - then the first day back to work I ended up with WD that night. I admit I am/was a perfectionist with my work (drafter for construction engineering) which was not a problem until the last couple of years since the engineers were concerned about results rather than my methods. Now everyone wants to micromanage the process of getting contract drawings done. All the engineers I worked with on a regular basis have left the company (laid off or quit) and I don't mesh with the new engineers coming down the pike. Many clients have gotten unreasonable as well.

I am on a mission now to try and track down any source of gluten (or other offending protein) that I could be getting. The foods I am eating (and their sources) are the same as they were 8 months ago when I went into remission (no gut turbulence, normal stools, no fatigue, and gained weight - all for about two months). The rice experiment screwed that up. I recovered from that but then the Holidays started. I ate at my sisters for Thanksgiving (4 months ago), Christmas (3 months ago) and my Birthday (2 months ago) - safe foods, but she used her utensils and there were non safe foods around as well (breads, desserts, etc.). Work may have been an issue - lots of pastries and pot-luck food in the breakroom, but that's always been the case and I was always careful to cover my food in the microwave and I never ate in the breakroom. Maybe my luck ran out on the work situation and I picked up a crumb or two.

The fecal fat score has me worried the most. The current diarrhea is nowhere near as bad as it was with the original flare and it happens now in the afternoon and evening, whereas the original flare was always in the morning. The last few days though the steatorrhea has become obvious, before it was either not visible in the stool or a "well, maybe" situation.

Anyway, if you read through all this I appreciate your patience. I thought I'd write down my thoughts in the hope that something would pop-out, an "aha!" moment, so to speak.

John R.