Ok when I go on a gluten free and casien free diet, after a time of healing will I be able to tolerate things that I cant tolerate now such as chocolate (which does not contain gluten or casien).
And when I first do the diet should I just start out at a gradual increase of foods? Like basically just start on rice, rice flour, meats, veggies, fruits, some light sugars etc. And then after a peroid of time add in foods. Or should I just eat normally except for gluten and casien product?
Just getting a guage here as I will start my diet in less than a month!
food intolerances while on diet
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
food intolerances while on diet
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Hi Andrew,
Eventually, you will probably be able to add back in some of your intolerances, but for a year or two, and possibly longer, you will need to avoid anything and everything that triggers a reaction, in order to allow your gut to heal.
IOW, just avoiding gluten and casein will not automatically and instantly allow you to tolerate other foods which bother you now. Your gut will have to heal first, and that seems to take around three years for many of us. YMMV, but there is documented research that indicates that 36 months is a reasonable timeframe for an upper limit.
You may want to consider Jean's elimination diet, as described in the Information on Diet forum.
Wayne
Eventually, you will probably be able to add back in some of your intolerances, but for a year or two, and possibly longer, you will need to avoid anything and everything that triggers a reaction, in order to allow your gut to heal.
IOW, just avoiding gluten and casein will not automatically and instantly allow you to tolerate other foods which bother you now. Your gut will have to heal first, and that seems to take around three years for many of us. YMMV, but there is documented research that indicates that 36 months is a reasonable timeframe for an upper limit.
You may want to consider Jean's elimination diet, as described in the Information on Diet forum.
Wayne
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
-
kate_ce1995
- Rockhopper Penguin
- Posts: 1321
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 5:53 pm
- Location: Vermont
Hi Andrew,
We do know though that some folks have quickly gotten rid of symptoms on the gf diet (I think one woman had relief of the D in about a week or two) while others take a longer time. From year of reading this forum, I'd recommend starting off simple and as you feel better (and its hard to understand just how you'll know now, but believe me, you'll know) add new foods slowly, one at a time. That way if something sets you back, you'll have an idea of what it was. In particular, add fiber back slowly....with some damage in the gut, that seems to upset the apple cart pretty quickly. For me, two weeks is about the time on a gf diet that I start to really notice that I'm feeling better...sort of like a detox period. Same was true even when I first started and noticed that it was helping aches and pains go away...it was at about the two week mark.
Good luck.
Katy
We do know though that some folks have quickly gotten rid of symptoms on the gf diet (I think one woman had relief of the D in about a week or two) while others take a longer time. From year of reading this forum, I'd recommend starting off simple and as you feel better (and its hard to understand just how you'll know now, but believe me, you'll know) add new foods slowly, one at a time. That way if something sets you back, you'll have an idea of what it was. In particular, add fiber back slowly....with some damage in the gut, that seems to upset the apple cart pretty quickly. For me, two weeks is about the time on a gf diet that I start to really notice that I'm feeling better...sort of like a detox period. Same was true even when I first started and noticed that it was helping aches and pains go away...it was at about the two week mark.
Good luck.
Katy
Andrew,
Whatever approach you choose, I encourage you to rotate the foods on your diet. When I stopped eating gluten, I ate many other non-gluten, whole grains, legumes, and some soy, which is often found in health bars. Now, I have intolerances to all those foods. Some I may have had already, and some I may have developed from eating them in abundance post-gluten free.
Apparently, there is an increased chance of developing new intolerances if you eat too much of any particular food, especially if your immune system is already on overdrive. On a rotation diet, you rotate your foods, usually by food family, every 4-5 days. To find out how to go about it, you can probably just google "rotation diet" or look at one of the books I mention below.
I simply could not conveive of the idea I might develop intolerances to all these 'healthy' foods like whole non-gluten grains and legumes. This naivete was, I now feel, a huge mistake on my part. It's a hassle to rotate foods, but every alergist I've read beleives it will decrease the likelihood of developing additional intolerances.
Secondly, Jean has provided a great basic elimination diet as Tex as pointed out. I'm very grateful that she has put so much work into that document for the benefit of others in the group. I would just like to add that often it is recommended to select both just a few foods, as she indicates, as well as 'rare' foods. Rare foods are ones that you have not eaten more than once a week. That is because people usually develop intolerances to the foods they eat frequently or have intolerances to the foods they crave. That's why many elimination diets recommend starting with meats like lamb or turkey, which are not eaten regularly by Americans. Selecting rare foods will increase your chance of spotting your intolerances. Like Jean has said, the key is to start out with the right combination of foods for you. Three of the four foods/beverages on her original list would make me sick immediately, so I need to use other foods. At this stage, water is my beverage of choice because I react to almost every type of tea. So like she says, you have to individualize it.
You could just go gluten and casein free and see how it goes for you. My symptoms definitely improved a lot just by dropping gluten. On the other hand, since a number of us have multiple intolerances, there's a good chance you do too. The elimination diet is the best way to find out. It's a pain, but nothing compared to years of continued problems.
Many nutritionists say that generally people can test and add some trigger foods back in after staying away from them for 3-6 months, but some may take much longer or you may never be able to tolerate some. Not gluten or casein of course. It's very individual. But many other food intolerances aren't fixed. But the key, in the research I've done, is to only add small amounts back in and to rotate your foods. Otherwise intolerances can recurr. Now, Tex says it takes 36 months to heal the gut typically so it may very well be that the 3-6 months doesn't work in the case of MC. He really knows his stuff, and there's a lot of real life wisdom based on the experrience of the people in this forum. I know I haven't eaten fruit for six months, but I tried a little on vacation and still have a mild reaction.
I regret that I haven't done a strict elimination diet before this myself. Jean has really inspired me to get with it. Over time I have eliminated many, many foods and have discovered my intolerances by trial and error...but I am not sure I have them all, so I think I am going to finally buckle down and go for it myself.
Some of the books I found helpful on this topic are:
The Allergy Exclusion Diet (gives an elimination & a rotation diet)
Five Years Wtihout Food (gives a rotation diet)
I am going to start working with a nutritionist soon who has expertise in gluten free diets and food allergy and intolerance. The appointments are by phone. I will let you know how it goes, in case you are interested in having that kind of support.
Thanks so much for the invitation to be your diet buddy. I would love that, but just when you start your diet I will be off to France for three years and won't have internet access then.
I know this is probably all a bit overwhelming!!!! Take a deep breath...
Be well, Celia
Whatever approach you choose, I encourage you to rotate the foods on your diet. When I stopped eating gluten, I ate many other non-gluten, whole grains, legumes, and some soy, which is often found in health bars. Now, I have intolerances to all those foods. Some I may have had already, and some I may have developed from eating them in abundance post-gluten free.
Apparently, there is an increased chance of developing new intolerances if you eat too much of any particular food, especially if your immune system is already on overdrive. On a rotation diet, you rotate your foods, usually by food family, every 4-5 days. To find out how to go about it, you can probably just google "rotation diet" or look at one of the books I mention below.
I simply could not conveive of the idea I might develop intolerances to all these 'healthy' foods like whole non-gluten grains and legumes. This naivete was, I now feel, a huge mistake on my part. It's a hassle to rotate foods, but every alergist I've read beleives it will decrease the likelihood of developing additional intolerances.
Secondly, Jean has provided a great basic elimination diet as Tex as pointed out. I'm very grateful that she has put so much work into that document for the benefit of others in the group. I would just like to add that often it is recommended to select both just a few foods, as she indicates, as well as 'rare' foods. Rare foods are ones that you have not eaten more than once a week. That is because people usually develop intolerances to the foods they eat frequently or have intolerances to the foods they crave. That's why many elimination diets recommend starting with meats like lamb or turkey, which are not eaten regularly by Americans. Selecting rare foods will increase your chance of spotting your intolerances. Like Jean has said, the key is to start out with the right combination of foods for you. Three of the four foods/beverages on her original list would make me sick immediately, so I need to use other foods. At this stage, water is my beverage of choice because I react to almost every type of tea. So like she says, you have to individualize it.
You could just go gluten and casein free and see how it goes for you. My symptoms definitely improved a lot just by dropping gluten. On the other hand, since a number of us have multiple intolerances, there's a good chance you do too. The elimination diet is the best way to find out. It's a pain, but nothing compared to years of continued problems.
Many nutritionists say that generally people can test and add some trigger foods back in after staying away from them for 3-6 months, but some may take much longer or you may never be able to tolerate some. Not gluten or casein of course. It's very individual. But many other food intolerances aren't fixed. But the key, in the research I've done, is to only add small amounts back in and to rotate your foods. Otherwise intolerances can recurr. Now, Tex says it takes 36 months to heal the gut typically so it may very well be that the 3-6 months doesn't work in the case of MC. He really knows his stuff, and there's a lot of real life wisdom based on the experrience of the people in this forum. I know I haven't eaten fruit for six months, but I tried a little on vacation and still have a mild reaction.
I regret that I haven't done a strict elimination diet before this myself. Jean has really inspired me to get with it. Over time I have eliminated many, many foods and have discovered my intolerances by trial and error...but I am not sure I have them all, so I think I am going to finally buckle down and go for it myself.
Some of the books I found helpful on this topic are:
The Allergy Exclusion Diet (gives an elimination & a rotation diet)
Five Years Wtihout Food (gives a rotation diet)
I am going to start working with a nutritionist soon who has expertise in gluten free diets and food allergy and intolerance. The appointments are by phone. I will let you know how it goes, in case you are interested in having that kind of support.
Thanks so much for the invitation to be your diet buddy. I would love that, but just when you start your diet I will be off to France for three years and won't have internet access then.
I know this is probably all a bit overwhelming!!!! Take a deep breath...
Be well, Celia
I beleive in magic!
-
moremuscle
- Rockhopper Penguin
- Posts: 706
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 6:16 am
- Location: South Carolina
Hi Andrew,
I have many intolerances including the two you have - gluten and casein.
It is my opinion that you don't need to worry much about foods that don't contain any of your intolerances; it is my personal experience that I went from horrible and out of control diarhea to formed stool within 24-48 hours of eliminating my intolerances from diet. My body had not lost the ability to form stool - it did not need much time to heal at all. Of course, I don't claim to be "normal" - you may be different from me or have your own personal damaged gut to take care of; but I am not sure that mine was damaged at all - it seemed to return to great functionality as soon as I got rid of the intolerances. Doesn't this sound like GOOD NEWS to you?
The part that took time for me was the intellectual part - meaning figuring out how to avoid the intolerances completely. There were a few tricky food items in my diet that took me for a twist. One of them was chocolate.
You asked about chocolate. Of course, you will never be able to eat milk chocolate again (casein). However, you will be able to tolerate some dark chocolates. Carefully read the ingredient list to make sure there is no dairy in there. I am intolerant of soy - I don't know if you were tested for soy and how it turned out but if you are soy intolerant you will have a hard time finding a chocolate you can tolerate as 99.9% of dark chocolates contain soy lecithin; this item will usually be listed on the ingredient list either as soy lecithin or simply as lecithin. There is a dark chocolate by Lindt (white package, high content of cocoa) that does not list lecithin on the ingredient list but I (and Jean) get extreme diarrhea from it - I think it may have lecithin in it but perhaps less than is required for labeling law.
I have found I can eat Hachez dark chocolate - two flavors are acceptable: The regular or classic and the orange flavor. This dark chocolate is made in Germany and only available at specialty stores; I buy it at the Fresh Market. No soy lecithin in this chocolate. Very bitter chocolate - takes a little getting used to. It is yummi! You can also find it on the internet.
Anything that is "allowed" on the paleolithic diet is good for you when going gluten and casein free - you would benefit from reading the Paleo Diet and "Neanderthin". Thus your own suggestions of meat, vegetables, and fruit are good - you can include eggs if you are OK with eggs and nuts if you are OK with nuts. While I was figuring out my intolerances I ate a lot of meals prepared in my rice cooker; thus using brown rice several times every day - this worked very well for me and I went into remission while eating rice however, there are members of the MI group that are doing much better on a rice and/or grain free diet so just pay attention to how your gut reacts to rice before you go out and buy a 25 lb sack of rice.
Is it a special kind of punishment that you are giving yourself not starting the diet allready?
I know, I know - the honeymoon
The sooner you start the sooner you will feel better and the sooner you will get a grip on your diet.
Love,
Karen
I have many intolerances including the two you have - gluten and casein.
It is my opinion that you don't need to worry much about foods that don't contain any of your intolerances; it is my personal experience that I went from horrible and out of control diarhea to formed stool within 24-48 hours of eliminating my intolerances from diet. My body had not lost the ability to form stool - it did not need much time to heal at all. Of course, I don't claim to be "normal" - you may be different from me or have your own personal damaged gut to take care of; but I am not sure that mine was damaged at all - it seemed to return to great functionality as soon as I got rid of the intolerances. Doesn't this sound like GOOD NEWS to you?
The part that took time for me was the intellectual part - meaning figuring out how to avoid the intolerances completely. There were a few tricky food items in my diet that took me for a twist. One of them was chocolate.
You asked about chocolate. Of course, you will never be able to eat milk chocolate again (casein). However, you will be able to tolerate some dark chocolates. Carefully read the ingredient list to make sure there is no dairy in there. I am intolerant of soy - I don't know if you were tested for soy and how it turned out but if you are soy intolerant you will have a hard time finding a chocolate you can tolerate as 99.9% of dark chocolates contain soy lecithin; this item will usually be listed on the ingredient list either as soy lecithin or simply as lecithin. There is a dark chocolate by Lindt (white package, high content of cocoa) that does not list lecithin on the ingredient list but I (and Jean) get extreme diarrhea from it - I think it may have lecithin in it but perhaps less than is required for labeling law.
I have found I can eat Hachez dark chocolate - two flavors are acceptable: The regular or classic and the orange flavor. This dark chocolate is made in Germany and only available at specialty stores; I buy it at the Fresh Market. No soy lecithin in this chocolate. Very bitter chocolate - takes a little getting used to. It is yummi! You can also find it on the internet.
Anything that is "allowed" on the paleolithic diet is good for you when going gluten and casein free - you would benefit from reading the Paleo Diet and "Neanderthin". Thus your own suggestions of meat, vegetables, and fruit are good - you can include eggs if you are OK with eggs and nuts if you are OK with nuts. While I was figuring out my intolerances I ate a lot of meals prepared in my rice cooker; thus using brown rice several times every day - this worked very well for me and I went into remission while eating rice however, there are members of the MI group that are doing much better on a rice and/or grain free diet so just pay attention to how your gut reacts to rice before you go out and buy a 25 lb sack of rice.
Is it a special kind of punishment that you are giving yourself not starting the diet allready?
I know, I know - the honeymoon
The sooner you start the sooner you will feel better and the sooner you will get a grip on your diet.
Love,
Karen
Inspired by the paleolithic diet and lifestyle -
living w/o gluten, dairy, soy, corn, and yeast.
living w/o gluten, dairy, soy, corn, and yeast.
Karen-
I was tested for gluten, casien, soy, yeast, and eggs. I came back with a casein and gluten intolerance. Everything else was fine so I am expecting that those are the only two intolerances that I have.
Also my small intestine is not damaged per the tests done by Enterolab, so I expect a relatively quickly healing time (1-3 months).
As for what I will eat when I start my diet: I will basically just stick to gFand CF foods.
Rice pastas
white and brown rice (I think all rice is legal and I jsut got a rice cooker... would you tell me some of your rice cooker recipes?)
Potatos
Meats (chicken, turkey (ground and whole), some red meat, and pork)
Fish (Salmon, talapia, shrimp, catfish)
Fruit- applesauce (the only fruit I can tolerate now)
Veggies- greenbeans (the only veggies I can tolerate now) and winter squash
Rice Breads and waffles
Corn and Rice Cereals
Gatorade and Water
Thats about it. I might throw in a baked good here and there but I will try and stick to that diet to begin with.
I was tested for gluten, casien, soy, yeast, and eggs. I came back with a casein and gluten intolerance. Everything else was fine so I am expecting that those are the only two intolerances that I have.
Also my small intestine is not damaged per the tests done by Enterolab, so I expect a relatively quickly healing time (1-3 months).
As for what I will eat when I start my diet: I will basically just stick to gFand CF foods.
Rice pastas
white and brown rice (I think all rice is legal and I jsut got a rice cooker... would you tell me some of your rice cooker recipes?)
Potatos
Meats (chicken, turkey (ground and whole), some red meat, and pork)
Fish (Salmon, talapia, shrimp, catfish)
Fruit- applesauce (the only fruit I can tolerate now)
Veggies- greenbeans (the only veggies I can tolerate now) and winter squash
Rice Breads and waffles
Corn and Rice Cereals
Gatorade and Water
Thats about it. I might throw in a baked good here and there but I will try and stick to that diet to begin with.
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Wow Andrew, I didn't realize you have so many intolerances ... to fruit and vegetables. I really feel for you! But I know that removing the gluten and casein will make a big differnce over time. You might want to look at my post about my appointment with the nutrionist. She really gave me some perspective. Also she said I could rotate my foods every 2 days instead of 4 and to eat as wide a variety of foods as possible. She emphasized not eating too much of any one food, as that can lead to developing an intolerance to it. Be well, Celia
I beleive in magic!
Celia,
Andrew's experience with fruits and vegetables is typical for untreated MC. Most of us had that problem in the early stages of recovery. It's the fiber, and the abrasive texture, that cause most of the problems when the gut is still sensitive. After his gut has had sufficient time to heal, he will once again be able to handle the fiber.
Also, does your nutritionist offer any substantiated basis for her claim that eating too much of any type of food can lead to future intolerances? I've never seen any documentation on that, though I've seen a lot of speculation about it, and those of us who are MI, tend to worry about it at one time or another. When it comes down to the nitty-gritty, though, I haven't been able to find any valid substantiation for those worries.
Here for example, is an article that begins the second paragraph with the phrase, "Eating the same foods over and over is one of the most sure-fire methods to developing a food intolerance." Note that there are no references, just the bold claim.
The article does have some basis in fact, since it mentions the fact that food intolerances are the result of leaky gut syndrome. However, their claim that continuing to regularly eat foods for which partially-digested polymers "leak" into the bloodstream, (these are my words, not their's, but this is, in effect, what they are saying), will eventually develop into an intolerance for that food, is false logic. If those long-chain polymers are leaking into the bloodstream, then an intolerance obviously already exists. True, it may get worse, with continued ingestion of the offending food, but that is simply a matter of degree--the intolerance is already in place, (and can be detected by monitoring antibody production).
A three, (or four, as they say), day rotation, will allow one to eat those foods without a large buildup of antibodies, and therefore, without noticeable symptoms, (I have proven that, with my own diet experiments), but that does not remove the fact that antibodies are being produced--it just means that the reaction is terminated before it gets out of hand. As soon as the reaction is initiated, it begins to decline, because the offending food is withdrawn from the diet. IOW, the intolerance already exists, and the rotation diet simply allows some of us to avoid a significant reaction, due to the fact that our intolerance has not yet progressed to the severe stage. In a sense, this amounts to playing games with our immune systems, and I haven't been able to decide if it's a safe game, or not, but it seems to work.
Note that those who already have highly developed intolerances to certain foods, cannot use a diet rotation that includes those foods, since they will experience a severe reaction in a matter of hours. The rotation only works for those of us who do not have an antibody production rate high enough to trigger significant symptoms, unless we eat the offending food on consecutive days.
The distinction hinges on one's definition of an intolerance. I say it exists if antibodies are being produced. Waiting until an intolerance has progressively developed to the point where ingestion of the offending food causes massive disruption in the body's normal processes, before calling it an intolerance, is, in my opinion, waiting a bit too long. Don't you agree?
Here's the article I am referring to:
http://www.chekinstitute.com/articles.cfm?select=30
I apologize if I seem like a PITA about this, but I'm just trying to inspire some "out-of-the-box" thinking here, and maybe some insight, and I really would like to see some valid documention, if it exists, since that information would be very, very valuable for all of us, in the long run. Since you've researched this concept, I'm hoping that you have found more substantial iinformation than I have. Frankly, I haven't had much luck in finding anything more than just opinions, and arbitrary claims.
I'm not asking for documentation that food allergies may become worse, with continued ingestion of the offending food, (that's a no-brainer)--what I'm looking for is evidence that foods that have never caused antibody production before, suddenly begin to trigger antibody production.
My theory is that once leaky gut syndrome develops, all potential food allergies are in place, (assuming that our LGS does not become worse), and we simply begin to notice the intolerances when the resultant antibody production that they trigger, surpasses a certain threshold. Since diet rotation delays the time to reach that threshold, we don't notice the symptoms as soon, but antibodies are still being produced, (at a lower level), in the gut. It appears that we are developing new intolerances, when in actuality, we are just experiencing a delayed ability to detect them, because they have to reach a certain threshold level of antibody production before we notice any significant symptoms.
Here's how I believe that it is possible to develop new intolerances: I believe that if we allow our leaky gut condition to get worse, then it becomes possible for additional, (larger), long-chain polymers to leak into the blodstream, and therefore initiate additional intlolerances. Since one of the causes of LGS is gut inflammation, obviously this stuff is all intricately linked.
This inflammation link means that it can be a self-perpetuating phenomenon, which implies that if we continue to eat foods to which we are intolerant, then yes, we may be exposing ourselves to the possibility of developing new intolerances. That's why we always advocate trying to control our symptoms as soon, and as thoroughly, as possible.
LGS can be caused by many things. If anyone needs a quick refresher:
http://www.ei-resource.org/lgs.asp
or,
http://www.caringmedical.com/conditions ... ndrome.htm
Tex
Andrew's experience with fruits and vegetables is typical for untreated MC. Most of us had that problem in the early stages of recovery. It's the fiber, and the abrasive texture, that cause most of the problems when the gut is still sensitive. After his gut has had sufficient time to heal, he will once again be able to handle the fiber.
Also, does your nutritionist offer any substantiated basis for her claim that eating too much of any type of food can lead to future intolerances? I've never seen any documentation on that, though I've seen a lot of speculation about it, and those of us who are MI, tend to worry about it at one time or another. When it comes down to the nitty-gritty, though, I haven't been able to find any valid substantiation for those worries.
Here for example, is an article that begins the second paragraph with the phrase, "Eating the same foods over and over is one of the most sure-fire methods to developing a food intolerance." Note that there are no references, just the bold claim.
The article does have some basis in fact, since it mentions the fact that food intolerances are the result of leaky gut syndrome. However, their claim that continuing to regularly eat foods for which partially-digested polymers "leak" into the bloodstream, (these are my words, not their's, but this is, in effect, what they are saying), will eventually develop into an intolerance for that food, is false logic. If those long-chain polymers are leaking into the bloodstream, then an intolerance obviously already exists. True, it may get worse, with continued ingestion of the offending food, but that is simply a matter of degree--the intolerance is already in place, (and can be detected by monitoring antibody production).
A three, (or four, as they say), day rotation, will allow one to eat those foods without a large buildup of antibodies, and therefore, without noticeable symptoms, (I have proven that, with my own diet experiments), but that does not remove the fact that antibodies are being produced--it just means that the reaction is terminated before it gets out of hand. As soon as the reaction is initiated, it begins to decline, because the offending food is withdrawn from the diet. IOW, the intolerance already exists, and the rotation diet simply allows some of us to avoid a significant reaction, due to the fact that our intolerance has not yet progressed to the severe stage. In a sense, this amounts to playing games with our immune systems, and I haven't been able to decide if it's a safe game, or not, but it seems to work.
Note that those who already have highly developed intolerances to certain foods, cannot use a diet rotation that includes those foods, since they will experience a severe reaction in a matter of hours. The rotation only works for those of us who do not have an antibody production rate high enough to trigger significant symptoms, unless we eat the offending food on consecutive days.
The distinction hinges on one's definition of an intolerance. I say it exists if antibodies are being produced. Waiting until an intolerance has progressively developed to the point where ingestion of the offending food causes massive disruption in the body's normal processes, before calling it an intolerance, is, in my opinion, waiting a bit too long. Don't you agree?
Here's the article I am referring to:
http://www.chekinstitute.com/articles.cfm?select=30
I apologize if I seem like a PITA about this, but I'm just trying to inspire some "out-of-the-box" thinking here, and maybe some insight, and I really would like to see some valid documention, if it exists, since that information would be very, very valuable for all of us, in the long run. Since you've researched this concept, I'm hoping that you have found more substantial iinformation than I have. Frankly, I haven't had much luck in finding anything more than just opinions, and arbitrary claims.
I'm not asking for documentation that food allergies may become worse, with continued ingestion of the offending food, (that's a no-brainer)--what I'm looking for is evidence that foods that have never caused antibody production before, suddenly begin to trigger antibody production.
My theory is that once leaky gut syndrome develops, all potential food allergies are in place, (assuming that our LGS does not become worse), and we simply begin to notice the intolerances when the resultant antibody production that they trigger, surpasses a certain threshold. Since diet rotation delays the time to reach that threshold, we don't notice the symptoms as soon, but antibodies are still being produced, (at a lower level), in the gut. It appears that we are developing new intolerances, when in actuality, we are just experiencing a delayed ability to detect them, because they have to reach a certain threshold level of antibody production before we notice any significant symptoms.
Here's how I believe that it is possible to develop new intolerances: I believe that if we allow our leaky gut condition to get worse, then it becomes possible for additional, (larger), long-chain polymers to leak into the blodstream, and therefore initiate additional intlolerances. Since one of the causes of LGS is gut inflammation, obviously this stuff is all intricately linked.
This inflammation link means that it can be a self-perpetuating phenomenon, which implies that if we continue to eat foods to which we are intolerant, then yes, we may be exposing ourselves to the possibility of developing new intolerances. That's why we always advocate trying to control our symptoms as soon, and as thoroughly, as possible.
LGS can be caused by many things. If anyone needs a quick refresher:
http://www.ei-resource.org/lgs.asp
or,
http://www.caringmedical.com/conditions ... ndrome.htm
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Hi Tex,
Sometimes I wonder if my 'dis-ease' is really the same as all of yours since my experience is a bit different. After all, my MC is mild, the doctor said we were lucky to even catch it from the biopsies. I've rarely had D. (just the onset event) and vegetables never caused it. New intolerances seemed to develop over time for me, but it's difficult to know for certain. In some ways, I feel my problem is food intolerance first and MC second...if that is possible. My husband is now going through the pits uncovering a million more intolerances, when he was well just a matter of months ago. I'm afraid that there is something else going on and that we migth be passing it back and forth. Who knows!
Anyhow, I didn't mean to make you PITA (whatever that is, sounds not good!!!!).
No, I didn't ask Melissa for documentation about whether eating the same food can create an intolerance to it! However, I researched her background and she is pretty savvy and cutting edge in the nutrition field, highly educated, and has hands on clinical experience with people who have food intolerance and complex illnesses.
All the 'experts' and books on delayed allergy that I've read do make the contention about eating a lot of the same food, but I don't know if it's even been proven by a research study. I don't beleive it's a general rule that applies to every single person. I beleive they are speaking about people who already have food intolerances and a comprimised immune system. And even then, that doesn't necessarily apply to everyone.
I seems to me that both your theory and this contention could be valid simultaneously. Some intolerances might pre-exist, whereas others might emerge as our immune system is comprimised. Or maybe it's like an urban myth! No idea.
At any rate, we are all accessing 'expert' information all the time. Some of it is contradictory, and so much is just not yet known. I'm just trying to determine what fits for me.
Sorry again if I set you off.
Take care, Celia
Sometimes I wonder if my 'dis-ease' is really the same as all of yours since my experience is a bit different. After all, my MC is mild, the doctor said we were lucky to even catch it from the biopsies. I've rarely had D. (just the onset event) and vegetables never caused it. New intolerances seemed to develop over time for me, but it's difficult to know for certain. In some ways, I feel my problem is food intolerance first and MC second...if that is possible. My husband is now going through the pits uncovering a million more intolerances, when he was well just a matter of months ago. I'm afraid that there is something else going on and that we migth be passing it back and forth. Who knows!
Anyhow, I didn't mean to make you PITA (whatever that is, sounds not good!!!!).
No, I didn't ask Melissa for documentation about whether eating the same food can create an intolerance to it! However, I researched her background and she is pretty savvy and cutting edge in the nutrition field, highly educated, and has hands on clinical experience with people who have food intolerance and complex illnesses.
All the 'experts' and books on delayed allergy that I've read do make the contention about eating a lot of the same food, but I don't know if it's even been proven by a research study. I don't beleive it's a general rule that applies to every single person. I beleive they are speaking about people who already have food intolerances and a comprimised immune system. And even then, that doesn't necessarily apply to everyone.
I seems to me that both your theory and this contention could be valid simultaneously. Some intolerances might pre-exist, whereas others might emerge as our immune system is comprimised. Or maybe it's like an urban myth! No idea.
At any rate, we are all accessing 'expert' information all the time. Some of it is contradictory, and so much is just not yet known. I'm just trying to determine what fits for me.
Sorry again if I set you off.
Take care, Celia
I beleive in magic!
Celia,
LOL. No, you didn't really "set me off". I'm just always looking for an opportunity to express my thoughts, and hopefully, to inspire others to reveal some of their insights. I certainly appreciate your input in our discussions.
LOL, (again), no, you didn't make me a PITA--I tend to do that, myself, without any help. Hahahahaha. PITA stands for Pain In The Ass.
You're quite correct, of course--we are all very different in many aspects, and surprisingly similar, in others.
Thanks for your insight,
Tex
LOL. No, you didn't really "set me off". I'm just always looking for an opportunity to express my thoughts, and hopefully, to inspire others to reveal some of their insights. I certainly appreciate your input in our discussions.
LOL, (again), no, you didn't make me a PITA--I tend to do that, myself, without any help. Hahahahaha. PITA stands for Pain In The Ass.
You're quite correct, of course--we are all very different in many aspects, and surprisingly similar, in others.
Thanks for your insight,
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Andrew,
Sure, I think it should work. I lived on meat and potatoes and rice for a couple of years. Once in a while, I had a serving of green beans or squash. Those two were the only vegetables that I could eat.
You can fine tune your diet as you go.
Be sure you watch the labels on the breakfast cereals. Most of the popular ones contain some form of gluten, (usually malted barley). You can find safe cereals at health food stores, but even there, you have to watch out for some forms of malted ingredients on the labels.
Bacon and eggs for breakfast are safe too. If you want a quick breakfast that you can warm up in a toaster, Van's Gourmet Waffles are good. You'll find them in the freezer, in most health food stores. Be sure that you buy the gluten free version, since they make regular waffles also, and many health food stores stock both kinds, in several flavors. The GF version does contain soy flour, but that shouldn't be a problem for you.
Tex
Sure, I think it should work. I lived on meat and potatoes and rice for a couple of years. Once in a while, I had a serving of green beans or squash. Those two were the only vegetables that I could eat.
You can fine tune your diet as you go.
Be sure you watch the labels on the breakfast cereals. Most of the popular ones contain some form of gluten, (usually malted barley). You can find safe cereals at health food stores, but even there, you have to watch out for some forms of malted ingredients on the labels.
Bacon and eggs for breakfast are safe too. If you want a quick breakfast that you can warm up in a toaster, Van's Gourmet Waffles are good. You'll find them in the freezer, in most health food stores. Be sure that you buy the gluten free version, since they make regular waffles also, and many health food stores stock both kinds, in several flavors. The GF version does contain soy flour, but that shouldn't be a problem for you.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thank you Tex-
I am glad that you have lived off of meats, potatos, and rice and very few veggies for years. I started to get concerned about my rice intake when celia said that over eating one particular food might cause new intolerances. I sure hope that isnt the case. I mean Asains eat rice for almost every meal, so shouldnt many of them be intolerant to rice? I guess only time will tell.
I am glad that you have lived off of meats, potatos, and rice and very few veggies for years. I started to get concerned about my rice intake when celia said that over eating one particular food might cause new intolerances. I sure hope that isnt the case. I mean Asains eat rice for almost every meal, so shouldnt many of them be intolerant to rice? I guess only time will tell.
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Andrew,
Gosh, I'm sorry if what I said made you worried. This is what the nutritionist said to me, e.g. not to eat too much of any one food. But we are all biochemically different. Like Tex, it may never be a problem for you.
The key, as Karen always says, is to listen to your body --- it will tell you if you are having trouble with any particular food. Some of my problems may be due to my newly discovered h. pylori infection rather than new intolerances. I don't think my MC ever got to the level it has for other people in this forum, so my set of problems is a little bit different.
My Asian friend Laurie is sensitive to carbohydrates like rice, not necessarily intolerant though. So I'm not sure that broad conclusions will apply. The most important thing is just to sort out the advice and then pay attention to how your body does with your diet.
Good luck, Celia
Gosh, I'm sorry if what I said made you worried. This is what the nutritionist said to me, e.g. not to eat too much of any one food. But we are all biochemically different. Like Tex, it may never be a problem for you.
The key, as Karen always says, is to listen to your body --- it will tell you if you are having trouble with any particular food. Some of my problems may be due to my newly discovered h. pylori infection rather than new intolerances. I don't think my MC ever got to the level it has for other people in this forum, so my set of problems is a little bit different.
My Asian friend Laurie is sensitive to carbohydrates like rice, not necessarily intolerant though. So I'm not sure that broad conclusions will apply. The most important thing is just to sort out the advice and then pay attention to how your body does with your diet.
Good luck, Celia
I beleive in magic!