Rec.pub. Lymphocytric Colitis DX/Gluten

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harvest_table
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Rec.pub. Lymphocytric Colitis DX/Gluten

Post by harvest_table »

This is a rather lengthy but interesting article. It's encouraging they are taking notice of gluten sensitivity. This and other articles lead me to believe that gluten is less likey to be a factor in the cause and treatment of people with LC, than CC. Folks with LC are less likey to respond to a gluten free diet than those with CC?
Intraepithelial Lymphocytosis in Architecturally Preserved Proximal Small Intestinal Mucosa: An Increasing Diagnostic Problem With a Wide Differential Diagnosis

Context.-An increased intraepithelial lymphocyte density in an architecturally normal proximal small intestinal mucosal biopsy is a common finding facing surgical pathologists dealing with gastrointestinal biopsy specimens. Approximately 1% to 2% of all proximal small intestinal biopsies will show this change. It is increasingly recognized by surgical pathologists that gluten- sensitive enteropathy is an important cause of this pattern; however, gluten-sensitive enteropathy accounts for the minority of all cases. A wide variety of immunologic stimuli can raise intraepithelial lymphocyte numbers. Among the other common associations are enteric infection, autoimmune disease, drugs, and gastric Helicobacter infection.

Objective.-To outline the causes of intraepithelial lymphocytosis, to highlight the importance and the difficulties faced in establishing gluten-sensitive enteropathy as the cause, and to aid the surgical pathologist in the routine sign out of these cases.

Data Sources.-A review of the literature detailing the causes or associations of proximal small intestinal intraepithelial lymphocytosis is presented.

Conclusions.-Increased lymphocyte numbers in the epithelium of architecturally preserved proximal small intestinal biopsies is a morphologic feature associated with a broad differential diagnosis.


CONCLUSION

Up to 2.5% of proximal small intestinal mucosal biopsies display increased IELs (>25 IELs per 100 epithelial cells) in the absence of villus architectural change. In most cases this is due to immunologic activation of the lymphocytes that are normally resident in the epithelium. The causes for this increase in numbers of IELs are multiple and include reactions to intraluminal antigens and small intestinal manifestations of autoimmune or other allied diseases (see Table). Gluten sensitivity is a common cause, accounting for 9% to 40% of cases.9,10,18 Other common associations include gastric H. pylori infection, a drug reaction, and autoimmune lymphocyte stimulation. In a significant number of cases, a cause is never established. It is the practice of one of us (I.B.) to add a comment to the surgical pathology report in cases in which intraepithelial lymphocytosis is the diagnosis. This comment states "the finding of intraepithelial lymphocytosis with preserved villus architecture is a non specific immunological phenomenon that has a large number of possible causes. A mild histological manifestation of gluten sensitivity is one of these causes. Unfortunately, celiac serology may be negative even in patients that subsequently prove to be gluten sensitive. Other common causes of this appearance include infective enteritis, H. pylori infection, a drug effect eg NSAIDs, and autoimmune disease. In many cases a specific cause is not identified."

Causes of Proximal Small Intestinal Intraepithelial Lymphocytosis With Normal Villus Architecture*

The establishment of a diagnosis of gluten sensitivity can be clinically difficult and relies on a weighted assessment of clinical, serologic, and histopathologic data. Surgical pathologists can help by highlighting cases that have a uniform distribution of IELs over the villus length rather than those showing increased numbers but in a persisting decrescendo pattern because the latter is an unusual feature for GSE.
Awareness of the various conditions associated with increased IELs in architecturally preserved proximal small intestinal mucosa is important to guide the clinician toward a correct diagnosis.
http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:fOn ... clnk&cd=10

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Joanna
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tex
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Post by tex »

Joanna,

This article is about EILs in the small intestine. Isn't this a study describing patients who fail the classic celiac diagnosis, and yet demonstrate inflammation due to gluten sensitivity, (or meds, or bacteria), (via elevated EILs), with or without indications of significant damage to the villi?

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Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by harvest_table »

Hi Tex, I'm learning here and trying to make sense of it all.

I found that article by googling microscopic colitis, gluten, 2006 and have come across the term intraepithelial lymphocytosis in relation to microscopic colitis various times. The quote below is from here http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:F0n ... =clnk&cd=5
Lymphocytic and collagenous colitis are probably related entities
associated with watery diarrhoea, normal mucosa macroscopically and
a histological picture dominated by intraepithelial lymphocytosis with or without a thickenend subepithelial collagen table. Some cases are
associated with coeliac disease, thyroiditis, inflammatory arthritis, an
atypical infectious diarrhoea (organism not yet identified), and drugs
such as NSAIDs. Recent work has shown that lymphocytic colitis may
be a heterogenous group, and particularly if the macroscopic
appearances are not typical, or if the intraepithelial lymphoyctes are
only mildly increased, other conditions such as drugs, infection, Crohn’s
disease or co-existent coeliac disease should be considered.
That article is appropriately titled, Making Sense of Lymphocytic and Collangenous Colitis! What caught my eye in the first article was that gluten was mentioned. It's all an interesting big ball of wax, that's for sure.

Love,
Joanna
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Post by artteacher »

Thank you so much Joanna,

You are a researcher par exellance!!! I have LC, and I think you're right, the gf diet, if it is helping, is doing it pretty darn slowly. I've had to cut out many other things, like sulfites, grains, and dairy, to stop the inflammation and symptoms. I think lections are a bigger factor than I originally thought. I guess I'd like to know which lections most resemble the proteins in human tissue: I've read dairy, wheat, legumes, and nightshades are the 4 main groups, but there are others. Bananas, for instance, have lectins in them, so are they in the banana group?

Love, Marsha
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Mild irritation?

Post by Arosebud »

I am happy to read the recent postings regarding diagnosing folks with CD symptoms who after having small intestine biopsies, don't get a definitive diagnosis of CD due to findings of "only" mild irritative response with normal architectural structure. I just had endoscopy with biopsies and waited 19 days for the results! My gastro is mailing me a letter, but the nurse was good enough to read it to me over the phone today. It sounded complicated, but the first part dealt with the mild irritative response. To what?? I have a definite dx of LC by a Mayo gastro. I have been on the GF diet for five years, then off it at suggestion of the Mayo gastro who was relying on blood tests, which were normal, after 12 day gluten challenge. Nothing but grief while eating gluten: depression, intermittant "D" and bad heartburn/reflux. Still, he claimed it could not be CD. Moved and changed gastros...the new one did the endoscopy. I had been eating gluten about five months, most of the time. I fully expected flattened or blunted villi. So I will wait for the letter, but in the meantime, wonder what the dx of the biopsies means?? Have given up gluten again, probably for good. Anyone have these problems?
Sylvia, Northern Minnesota - Do good or do not.
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Post by harvest_table »

Hi Marsha,

Thank you, your superb research on Lectins interests me.

So, you have LC? Maybe that would explain a few things like, why fewer folks with LC find relief GF because you may have other issues to deal with than those of us with CC? I have CC, and have been GF for 2 solid years and and eating very close to Paleo for the last 16 months but I'm also having some issues and think lectins may be causing some problems for me as well. Not D, brain fog.

Have you seen this site? I'm not to into the bloodtype thing, but it's got some good stuff on lectins among other things. http://www.dadamo.com/wiki/wiki.pl/Lectins

I don't know what group bananas would fall into. Will research that more but I found this quote on the site above.
Dietary lectins have been shown to induce the production of Interleukin-4, which in turn activates IgE. (3) This perhaps explains why one of the more common benefits reported by those who follow the blood type food plans is an improvement in allergic manifestations, sinusitis, and asthma. Many bacteria use lectins to attach to host tissue, and these lectins are some of the more highly allergenic parts of the organism. Many food lectins trigger IgE, including lectins found in bananas, chestnuts, and avocados, all implicated in what has been termed "latex fruit allergies." Kiwi fruit lectins also trigger IgE. Lectins from pea, broad bean, lentil, jack bean, soybean, peanut, and wheat germ have been shown to bind directly with IgE and initiate the release of histamine, which can produce a feeling of spaciness, a condition characterized by an inability to focus and concentrate.
Latex fruit allergies....that could explain my BRAIN DRAIN! I eat a banana almost every day!

Love,
Joanna
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Post by harvest_table »

Hi Rosebud!

It's good to see you! You snuck your post in while I was writing the other
one. Sorry to hear your having such a hard time of it, darn. Giving up gluten for good would probably be a good idea.

I was in Minnesota last month for a couple weeks and thought about you. I was in the Aitken and Fergus Falls areas. Would that have been within driving distance to visit each other? If so, maybe next visit...

Love,
Joanna
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Post by Arosebud »

Hi Joanna, I live in Wadena, MN which is between Aitkin and Fergus Falls. So far, I have never met anyone who had these unique health problems, except on the internet. In addition to staying GF, I am going to try an elimination diet, of sorts. This website is sooo helpful, and I am feeling like I was blessed with some darn peculiar set of health problems....but at least it's far better than not having a clue as to what the problem is! The last time I felt really good, remarkably good, I had been battling "D" and had eaten only jello and white rice for two days. My blood pressure dropped to normal, and I had energy and the urge to "go some place!" rather than wimping around and refusing invites because I just didn't feel good. But then I went back to the regular GF diet, and back to my old self. When one gives up a lot of dietary staples, like dairy, gluten, eggs, soy, etc. etc. I suppose relying on supplements for vitamins/minerals becomes a must. Still learning.
Sylvia, Northern Minnesota - Do good or do not.
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Post by tex »

Sylvia,

I don't know what your Mayo GI was thinking when he subjected you to a 12 day gluten challenge, but that's not anywhere near long enough for a valid celiac diagnosis using a blood test. For a reliable blood test result, a challenge would have to last at least two or three months. Anything less would provide pretty "iffy" results.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by mle_ii »

According to Dr Green it takes at least 1 month and 4 slices of bread a day on up to 3 months. Even with that he says that there might not still be enough damage to show up on a serologic test for CD.
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Post by Lucy »

Hmmm, makes ya wonder what villi ever did to them, doesn't it?
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Post by harvest_table »

Arosebud wrote:Hi Joanna, I live in Wadena, MN which is between Aitkin and Fergus Falls. So far, I have never met anyone who had these unique health problems, except on the internet.
Hi Sylvia! Wow, I passed through Wadena a couple times traveling between Aitken and Fergus. Wish I had asked you about it earlier so we could have had a visit. It's a great experience meeting MCr's in person. Christine lives in Waconia and we had luncheon chat together- it was really nice. So next time, let's make plans for a visit okay? I'm going to be in MN again Sept 20-26 for my Sisters wedding but don't think I'll have time to get up north. Our next trip planned is in Early November sometime.

I'm sorry to hear your having such a hard time. If I understand correctly you do have a definate LC DX from Mayo? Did you read here that in some cases folks with LC have a more dificult time finding relief GF than folks with CC? I agree with Wayne, with what we know about MC and Gluten it's crazy your GI would ask you to ingest it in order to take a blood test for CD. It's good to hear GF has worked for you in the past - noticed you mentioned in another post possible problem with Lectins. Marsha(artteacher) has posted lot's of info about Lectins and Sulfites which have lead to some interesting discussions. It might help you to do a search for those or look up Marshas posts.

You also mentioned supplements, I don't take any.There are others folks that can comment on that I'm sure.

So glad your found us and hang in there! Look forward to meeting you someday in the not to distant future.

Love,
Joanna
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Post by artteacher »

WADENA, MN!!!!! My whole family is from New York Mills and Wadena. Now I have some who have migrated as far as Fergus Falls and Minneapolis, but I consider them pioneers. Are you by any chance Finnish? Paaiva!

My doc had me eat two pieces of bread a day for a month, and I had negative blood test results for celiac, as well as negative biopsy. (no flattened villi I guess) But my biopsies did show chronic inflammation consistant with MC - no collagen, though. Then after about a year, I think, on a df/gf/legumef, largely protein diet, my biopsy showed no sign of inflammation. It's back in a heartbeat if I eat dairy, or other irritants, though. The frustration is explaining it to the doc, because he doesn't know what to make of that. I don't fall into any of his "catagories" of disease, so I'm just an anomoly, or a psych case, I guess. So, yes, I totally empathize with your situation. I'm sure Polly would, as well. I think those of us with LC all would: but is that correct guys? Anybody with LC, please comment . . .

Joanna,
Thank you for you research on lectins. I don't think I've seen that site. I think it's really hard to find lectin info. Research seems to be in the beginning stages. Maybe we could start a lectin place in on the site, so we can share what we're reading. I have a few sites saved in my "favorites". I'll read what you posted so far and write you soon. In order to distinguish whether it was the sugars, or the lectins in beans that causes digestive problems for me, I looked up ways to soak lentils to make them them most digestible. Even though I soaked lentils by what seemed to be the best way possible to pre-digest the offending sugars, I still had a weird reaction: insomnia like I'd had caffeine or sudafed. It was a noticable "wired" jittery feeling. Then acid D. But NO GAS! The soaking really worked in that regard. I don't really remember brain fog, but then I have it often enough that it's part of my personality: just ask Peggy. :pigtail:

Anyway, don't want to write a book. It sure is easy to get on a topic and ramble, isn't it?

Love you guys,
Marsha
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Re: .

Post by mle_ii »

artteacher wrote:My doc had me eat two pieces of bread a day for a month, and I had negative blood test results for celiac, as well as negative biopsy. (no flattened villi I guess) But my biopsies did show chronic inflammation consistant with MC - no collagen, though. Then after about a year, I think, on a df/gf/legumef, largely protein diet, my biopsy showed no sign of inflammation. It's back in a heartbeat if I eat dairy, or other irritants, though. The frustration is explaining it to the doc, because he doesn't know what to make of that. I don't fall into any of his "catagories" of disease, so I'm just an anomoly, or a psych case, I guess. So, yes, I totally empathize with your situation. I'm sure Polly would, as well. I think those of us with LC all would: but is that correct guys? Anybody with LC, please comment . . .
Diagnosed with LC here. I'm pretty much the same, eat something wrong and I get a flare of the colitis, eat good and I'm mostly fine. As for being an anomoly, my guess is if they'd investigate the anomolies they'd figure something out.
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Post by artteacher »

You must be on the site at the same time as I am. If it's an encouragement, I seem to be getting better, and tolerating slips in my diet a whole lot more than I used to. I think the progress is much slower for us. It's hard for me to be patient, that's for sure.

Love,
Marsha
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