Hey All!!! Hows it going? Its been a little while!!
Let see, the last time I visisted I was not doing so well. At the time our 1 year old dog was very ill and the vets didnt know what was wrong with him. He was sick for about 5 months and consequently my stomach started to act up- but not that badly. As a last resort med, the vet gave Oakley (our dog) prednisone... Now i know some of you dont like PRED but I am telling you Oakley loves it. He has made a huge turn around, gained 20 pounds, and is active and youthful as he should be. Even though we still dont know what is wrong with him we are grateful for each day we are able to spend with him.
Needless to say this put our financials in a hole... and being newly married that can be a hard thing. Luckily I have a good wife... but we are still trying to dig ourselves out of the $5,000 hole. So basically I am stressed about that- big time and my stomach has started to turn again...
So I have been on the diet for about 1.5 years now... wow has it been that long? But I am still not completety off of imodium... is that bad? I also still have D from time to time with definate mucous... but then it seems to go away... If I were to ingest gluten, milk, or even a food that I might have a mild reaction, would mucous come from that? And it might not be a flare?
This happens the most the mornings after I eat read meat, drink too much soda (no caff. ever!), chocolate, or have a gluten free beer. Then after about 36 hours of stomach upset, gas, and sometimes D I get back to normal.
But on a bright note- this past summer I got to feeling so much better that I actually joined an adult baseball league! I never thought I would play baseball again, sprint, dive after balls etc... but I was able to play about 1 year into the diet. I hope that next year I feel even better, but I would like to iron some things out.
Hey Tex- when did you stat to eat veggies and fruits again? Sometimes when I eat greenbeans they give me some troubles...
How much longer until my gut heals? Maybe it wont get to 100% because of all the alcohol, sugars, sodas, and fast food that I practically had hooked up to an IV in my younger days?? Maybe just need some encouragement :)
Good to be back and reading!
Update- recent troubles
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
Update- recent troubles
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Hey Andrew!
It's good to "see" you again, and it's good to hear that Oakley is doing fine now. It's definitely not good to see that it took $5,000 worth of debt to do it, though. One would think that your vet could cut you a little slack on a bill that size.
There's a good chance that the stress from that expense may be making a big contribution toward your returning symptoms. Mucus is the mechanism that prevents our digestive system from digesting it's own walls, so some of it is always present. However, the body produces copious amounts of mucus when it senses that the mucosa is becoming inflamed due to the presence of irritating or caustic agents in the lumen. I honestly don't know if stress can cause inflammation, but I don't believe the mucus would be there if inflammation were not present, and I'm pretty sure that stress can sufficiently modify the balance of many of the chemical processes that are continually going on in the body, such that it can lead to adverse changes in the lumen.
Needless to say, when you are having these reactions, your gut is not healing. Are you sure the beer you are drinking is gluten free, or could it possibly be a very low gluten product, instead. Is that dark chocolate? Light chocolate, (milk chocolate), contains milk, of course.
I never stopped eating well-cooked broccoli and green beans, but I didn't eat them very often, (usually only once or twice a week). All fruit, and all other vegetables, I pretty much avoided for two to three years.
It took my gut a long time to heal, presumably because I also had diverticulitis issues, which almost surely slowed down the healing process. I started the GF diet in August of 2001. A year and a half later, I also cut out dairy and corn, and the reactions pretty much stopped at that point. That was about February, 2002. In May of 2005, (over three years later, and four and a half years after beginning the GF diet), a stool test at Enterolab showed that I still had borderline small intestinal damage, based on a fecal fat score. Somewhere along in here is where I started slowly adding a few things back into my diet. Sometimes, when I would try something that I hadn't eaten in a couple of years or so, I would feel "off" afterwards, as though it wasn't digesting very well. After a few weeks, though, of eating it once or twice a week, it got better, (presumably because my gut bacteria adapted to a slightly different population distribution, in order to improve digestion).
Excess amounts of certain "ingredients" in the diet, and certain other factors, can lead to the leaky gut syndrome. This area still needs a lot of research, but I believe that it has been demonstrated that LGS can be caused by excess amounts of alcohol, sugar, gluten, and possibly other things in the diet. It can also be caused by stress, NSAIDs, and possibly other medications, yeast overgrowth, and small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, or other bowel bacterial infections. IOW, it can be caused by anything that can trigger MC - isn't that interesting. I'm almost certain that my LGS was caused by sugar, since I used to eat waaaaaaaaaay too much of it. The thing is, once we develop LGS, it takes progressively less and less of the trigger ingredient to cause the problem, (IOW our body becomes more sensitive to it, (sort of like an allergic reaction), so that eventually, even small amounts can cause a reaction.
It's difficult to say what your "Achilles Heel" might be, as far as LGS is concerned, but I had to cut out virtually all sugar while I was recovering. The only sugar that I could tolerate without getting sick, was maple sugar - why I could tolerate it, I have no idea, because even honey caused problems. It sounds as though your prior diet may have been a lot like mine, except that I had a lot more years to accumulate damage before the ax fell. Theoretically, since you're younger, you should heal faster, but trying to figure out how long it takes to heal is a pretty complex problem. I suspect that like most things related to MC, we're probably all different in that area.
Tex
It's good to "see" you again, and it's good to hear that Oakley is doing fine now. It's definitely not good to see that it took $5,000 worth of debt to do it, though. One would think that your vet could cut you a little slack on a bill that size.
There's a good chance that the stress from that expense may be making a big contribution toward your returning symptoms. Mucus is the mechanism that prevents our digestive system from digesting it's own walls, so some of it is always present. However, the body produces copious amounts of mucus when it senses that the mucosa is becoming inflamed due to the presence of irritating or caustic agents in the lumen. I honestly don't know if stress can cause inflammation, but I don't believe the mucus would be there if inflammation were not present, and I'm pretty sure that stress can sufficiently modify the balance of many of the chemical processes that are continually going on in the body, such that it can lead to adverse changes in the lumen.
Needless to say, when you are having these reactions, your gut is not healing. Are you sure the beer you are drinking is gluten free, or could it possibly be a very low gluten product, instead. Is that dark chocolate? Light chocolate, (milk chocolate), contains milk, of course.
I never stopped eating well-cooked broccoli and green beans, but I didn't eat them very often, (usually only once or twice a week). All fruit, and all other vegetables, I pretty much avoided for two to three years.
It took my gut a long time to heal, presumably because I also had diverticulitis issues, which almost surely slowed down the healing process. I started the GF diet in August of 2001. A year and a half later, I also cut out dairy and corn, and the reactions pretty much stopped at that point. That was about February, 2002. In May of 2005, (over three years later, and four and a half years after beginning the GF diet), a stool test at Enterolab showed that I still had borderline small intestinal damage, based on a fecal fat score. Somewhere along in here is where I started slowly adding a few things back into my diet. Sometimes, when I would try something that I hadn't eaten in a couple of years or so, I would feel "off" afterwards, as though it wasn't digesting very well. After a few weeks, though, of eating it once or twice a week, it got better, (presumably because my gut bacteria adapted to a slightly different population distribution, in order to improve digestion).
Excess amounts of certain "ingredients" in the diet, and certain other factors, can lead to the leaky gut syndrome. This area still needs a lot of research, but I believe that it has been demonstrated that LGS can be caused by excess amounts of alcohol, sugar, gluten, and possibly other things in the diet. It can also be caused by stress, NSAIDs, and possibly other medications, yeast overgrowth, and small intestinal bacterial overgrowth, or other bowel bacterial infections. IOW, it can be caused by anything that can trigger MC - isn't that interesting. I'm almost certain that my LGS was caused by sugar, since I used to eat waaaaaaaaaay too much of it. The thing is, once we develop LGS, it takes progressively less and less of the trigger ingredient to cause the problem, (IOW our body becomes more sensitive to it, (sort of like an allergic reaction), so that eventually, even small amounts can cause a reaction.
It's difficult to say what your "Achilles Heel" might be, as far as LGS is concerned, but I had to cut out virtually all sugar while I was recovering. The only sugar that I could tolerate without getting sick, was maple sugar - why I could tolerate it, I have no idea, because even honey caused problems. It sounds as though your prior diet may have been a lot like mine, except that I had a lot more years to accumulate damage before the ax fell. Theoretically, since you're younger, you should heal faster, but trying to figure out how long it takes to heal is a pretty complex problem. I suspect that like most things related to MC, we're probably all different in that area.
Tex
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barbaranoela
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 5394
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 6:11 pm
- Location: New York
Hiya Andrew---yes, it certainly has been awhile since U popped in and caught us up on issues happening in your life---
Well like we always said here---what works for one--doesnt need to work for all----and I guess that reflects to our little *friends* too--
My son and DIL have a family of 5 --3 dogs and 2 catz--(brothers -can U believe that) and it costs them a megga bucks for their care----
U never found out what Oakley's problem were-?--but if the PRED. worked then I guess thats what matters--heck, when I had to go on PRED.,I feared the thought of it BUT it did the job for me---so we DO what we have to DO~~~
When we had our little *hot-dogs*---one had back surgery(disc troubles)--another had one leg amputated along with half of his ear which was caused by an accident---the remaining one Becky died from cancer---and like U and Mrs. Andrew we went for the $$$$ to do everything--cus they were/are OUR family--
I guess the stress of all this and your finances--and maybe your diet have thrown U into a bit of TROUBLE!!!!
So now its time to take care of ANDREW and get yourself back on the *healthy* road--
Wishing U a better year--
luve Barbara
Well like we always said here---what works for one--doesnt need to work for all----and I guess that reflects to our little *friends* too--
My son and DIL have a family of 5 --3 dogs and 2 catz--(brothers -can U believe that) and it costs them a megga bucks for their care----
U never found out what Oakley's problem were-?--but if the PRED. worked then I guess thats what matters--heck, when I had to go on PRED.,I feared the thought of it BUT it did the job for me---so we DO what we have to DO~~~
When we had our little *hot-dogs*---one had back surgery(disc troubles)--another had one leg amputated along with half of his ear
which was caused by an accident---the remaining one Becky died from cancer---and like U and Mrs. Andrew we went for the $$$$ to do everything--cus they were/are OUR family--I guess the stress of all this and your finances--and maybe your diet have thrown U into a bit of TROUBLE!!!!
So now its time to take care of ANDREW and get yourself back on the *healthy* road--
Wishing U a better year--
luve Barbara
the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self-control
Well, I'm one that won't take pred again unless I have no choice but it sounds like Oakley had no choice. So glad he is doing so well and I hope he continues to be good. I would have given him the pred also because sometimes we just need what we need.
I'm sorry you are having MC problems and I surely hope you'll be back on track soon. I hope the vet is cutting you some slack on time for payment if nothing else.
If you get time, post another picture of Oakley.
Love, Shirley
I'm sorry you are having MC problems and I surely hope you'll be back on track soon. I hope the vet is cutting you some slack on time for payment if nothing else.
If you get time, post another picture of Oakley.
Love, Shirley
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
-- Winston Churchill
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annie oakley
- King Penguin
- Posts: 3859
- Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 5:56 pm
Well I am with Shirley On the pred but am so happy that oakly is better. I fell like you every day with My 4 legged hairy children the better. Stree seems to effect us all, and the ills of our pets will certainly effect us. When My Buck and Jasmine are ill>>>>>I am beside my self and then I flare. Love Oma
May I be more compassionate and loving than yeterday*and be able to spot the idiots in advance
Andrew
My congratulations.
You have discovered a set of intolerance's that many others here can equate with.
“This happens the most the mornings after I eat read meat, drink too much soda (no caff. ever!), chocolate, or have a gluten free beer.”
With realizations and insights like that many have felt better and better, step by step.
So will you.
To your recovery
Matthew
My congratulations.
You have discovered a set of intolerance's that many others here can equate with.
“This happens the most the mornings after I eat read meat, drink too much soda (no caff. ever!), chocolate, or have a gluten free beer.”
With realizations and insights like that many have felt better and better, step by step.
So will you.
To your recovery
Matthew
Hey Guys-
Geez- sorry it took so long for me to respond. This time of season for accountants is CRAZY!!!
So for the past month I have kept a food diary and I noticed that when I drink a sprite (and only a sprite) every now and then I am fine. But when I drink more than 12 oz in one week I start to get a little off.
Chocolate is the same way (and it is dark choc- no milk, gluten, soy, diary, or nuts by enjoy life)- but I can handle a bit more chocolate than soda.
Then there is the gluten free beer that I love but never never never likes me! Every morning after I drink ONE AND ONLY ONE I dont feel so great. The only thing I can kina handle is a light margarita- light on the tequilla.
And whenever I get stressed then my stomach goes downhill.
I just need to stick to the blander foods for a little while longer; however, I notice that since introducing chocolate and sprite I have been able to progressively eat more and more without having problems. Sometimes I just go overboard!!!
How can I attach a picture of Oakley?
Once April comes and goes I will be back more often... not enough time in the day!
Oh yeah Tex- the vet DID cut us a break after a while- we rec'd 30% off of services after a while since it seemed liked he was in the Hospital more than at home... we are lucky it wasnt more!!!![/img]
Geez- sorry it took so long for me to respond. This time of season for accountants is CRAZY!!!
So for the past month I have kept a food diary and I noticed that when I drink a sprite (and only a sprite) every now and then I am fine. But when I drink more than 12 oz in one week I start to get a little off.
Chocolate is the same way (and it is dark choc- no milk, gluten, soy, diary, or nuts by enjoy life)- but I can handle a bit more chocolate than soda.
Then there is the gluten free beer that I love but never never never likes me! Every morning after I drink ONE AND ONLY ONE I dont feel so great. The only thing I can kina handle is a light margarita- light on the tequilla.
And whenever I get stressed then my stomach goes downhill.
I just need to stick to the blander foods for a little while longer; however, I notice that since introducing chocolate and sprite I have been able to progressively eat more and more without having problems. Sometimes I just go overboard!!!
How can I attach a picture of Oakley?
Once April comes and goes I will be back more often... not enough time in the day!
Oh yeah Tex- the vet DID cut us a break after a while- we rec'd 30% off of services after a while since it seemed liked he was in the Hospital more than at home... we are lucky it wasnt more!!!![/img]
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Hi Andrew,
Good to "see" you again. You evidently have been busy. LOL.
I'm not sure if this is true of all GF beers, but apparently, a lot of them are not truly GF, but low-gluten, or ultra-low-gluten. IOW, they contain some traces of gluten, but most of them will supposedly pass the Codex Alimentarius specs, which sets a threshold of 20 ppm. The U. S. government is expected to adopt that same standard in August, (I believe). Right now, we don't really have an "official" standard for GF labeling.
Here's how you can add images to posts. The first method uses Imageshack, which a lot of us use. I don't recall the name of the other image-hosting service, because I don't normally use it, but using it is easier than using Imageshack.
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1988
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3839
I'm glad to hear that you got a decent break on that bill.
Tex
Good to "see" you again. You evidently have been busy. LOL.
I'm not sure if this is true of all GF beers, but apparently, a lot of them are not truly GF, but low-gluten, or ultra-low-gluten. IOW, they contain some traces of gluten, but most of them will supposedly pass the Codex Alimentarius specs, which sets a threshold of 20 ppm. The U. S. government is expected to adopt that same standard in August, (I believe). Right now, we don't really have an "official" standard for GF labeling.
Here's how you can add images to posts. The first method uses Imageshack, which a lot of us use. I don't recall the name of the other image-hosting service, because I don't normally use it, but using it is easier than using Imageshack.
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1988
http://www.perskyfarms.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3839
I'm glad to hear that you got a decent break on that bill.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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annie oakley
- King Penguin
- Posts: 3859
- Joined: Fri May 13, 2011 5:56 pm
Hey Andrew>>>I have a part rx of Pred if you want it for oakly, Glad to hear he's doing better. Nothing hurts my heart like one of our furr babies being ill. And I hope you get to feeling better too Love Oma
May I be more compassionate and loving than yeterday*and be able to spot the idiots in advance
Thanks for the thought Oma, but the pred we get for Oakley is dirt cheap- almost as cheap as meds in Mexico.
Tex- yeah I kinda figured the beer might have some gluten in it. I drink the New Grist and Red Bridge (made by busch) so I am sure there is cross contamination there. When you talk about the 20 ppm being "legal" for celiacs... are we more or less sensative than celaics? I would imagine since we dont have the damaged villi like people with celaic wouldnt we not get so ill when we ingest up to 20 ppm of gluten? I know diseases are different but from what I have learned MC and celiac disease are closely linked.
OR ON THE OTHER HAND, do most of the gluten free producers follow the 20 ppm? If not then there could be more gluten than the 20 ppm because there is no set threshold?
Tex- yeah I kinda figured the beer might have some gluten in it. I drink the New Grist and Red Bridge (made by busch) so I am sure there is cross contamination there. When you talk about the 20 ppm being "legal" for celiacs... are we more or less sensative than celaics? I would imagine since we dont have the damaged villi like people with celaic wouldnt we not get so ill when we ingest up to 20 ppm of gluten? I know diseases are different but from what I have learned MC and celiac disease are closely linked.
OR ON THE OTHER HAND, do most of the gluten free producers follow the 20 ppm? If not then there could be more gluten than the 20 ppm because there is no set threshold?
Dr Fine test shows positive for gluten and casien but negative for soy, eggs, and yeast
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Maybe its UC maybe its MC? Who knows at this point, but at least I know my intollerances now... so heres to the road to healing!
Andrew,
As far as whether we are more or less sensitive to "gluten" than celiacs, I have a hunch that we are all different in our sensitivities, and I'll bet the same is true of celiacs. Some of us seem to be more sensitive than the average celiac, while others seem to be less sensitive. For example, it is claimed that most celiacs can safely eat oats, but a long trial last spring showed that I am intolerant to avenin, (the prolamin in oats that is the equivalent of gluten in wheat), and this was oats that was certified to be free of any wheat contamination.
Yes, most manufacturers do seem to follow the 20 ppm rule, but there are many research reports on the web, where products randomly pulled off the shelves in stores were tested, and found to be significantly above the 20 ppm level. For example, one of the reports I read was about a testing program that included several respected brands of oats, including McCanns Irish Oats, (a brand that has for decades been touted as the "only" "reliable", gluten-free, uncontaminated brand on the world market. When the results were tabulated, several samples from McCanns tested as high as 200 ppm, with the lowest being around 80 to 100, if I remember correctly. Many of the others were also above the 20 ppm level in that particular test, but mostly under 100 ppm. Remember this test was for wheat gluten, not for the avenin, which is found naturally in oats. Actually, there are no tests available to detect avenin, (nor secalin, nor hordein, for that matter). (Secalin is the offending prolamin in rye, and hordein is the prolamin in barley that causes us problems.) The only prolamin that can actually be tested for, (in either serum tests or stool tests), is wheat gluten.
The problem with manufacturing a product that might contain an allergen, or a toxin, or whatever, is that most of the better tests are destructive, which means that only random samples can be tested, (all of the product itself cannot be tested, because it would be destroyed in the testing process), and so the reliability of a rating depends on the method by which samples are selected. Having to deal with that issue, (sampling), in my own business, I can assure you that it is impossible to get 100% test reliability, because there is no way to guarantee that the samples that are selected are truly representative of the batch. No matter how hard you try, occasionally batches can slip through, from which the samples tested just fine, but which when sampled further down the line, traces of the contaminant might be found. Sampling is inherently problematic, but there is no way to get around it. Unfortunately it is a necessary part of what is currently the best technology we have available for testing.
Tex
As far as whether we are more or less sensitive to "gluten" than celiacs, I have a hunch that we are all different in our sensitivities, and I'll bet the same is true of celiacs. Some of us seem to be more sensitive than the average celiac, while others seem to be less sensitive. For example, it is claimed that most celiacs can safely eat oats, but a long trial last spring showed that I am intolerant to avenin, (the prolamin in oats that is the equivalent of gluten in wheat), and this was oats that was certified to be free of any wheat contamination.
Yes, most manufacturers do seem to follow the 20 ppm rule, but there are many research reports on the web, where products randomly pulled off the shelves in stores were tested, and found to be significantly above the 20 ppm level. For example, one of the reports I read was about a testing program that included several respected brands of oats, including McCanns Irish Oats, (a brand that has for decades been touted as the "only" "reliable", gluten-free, uncontaminated brand on the world market. When the results were tabulated, several samples from McCanns tested as high as 200 ppm, with the lowest being around 80 to 100, if I remember correctly. Many of the others were also above the 20 ppm level in that particular test, but mostly under 100 ppm. Remember this test was for wheat gluten, not for the avenin, which is found naturally in oats. Actually, there are no tests available to detect avenin, (nor secalin, nor hordein, for that matter). (Secalin is the offending prolamin in rye, and hordein is the prolamin in barley that causes us problems.) The only prolamin that can actually be tested for, (in either serum tests or stool tests), is wheat gluten.
The problem with manufacturing a product that might contain an allergen, or a toxin, or whatever, is that most of the better tests are destructive, which means that only random samples can be tested, (all of the product itself cannot be tested, because it would be destroyed in the testing process), and so the reliability of a rating depends on the method by which samples are selected. Having to deal with that issue, (sampling), in my own business, I can assure you that it is impossible to get 100% test reliability, because there is no way to guarantee that the samples that are selected are truly representative of the batch. No matter how hard you try, occasionally batches can slip through, from which the samples tested just fine, but which when sampled further down the line, traces of the contaminant might be found. Sampling is inherently problematic, but there is no way to get around it. Unfortunately it is a necessary part of what is currently the best technology we have available for testing.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.