nausea and fatigue

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Andi
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nausea and fatigue

Post by Andi »

I am sorry to keep asking so many questions. A little over a month ago I had never heard of MC eventhough I have had symptoms for about 6 years.
Over the years as the diarrhea began I also began having some other symptoms. About 2 or 3 times a year, esp. when the diarrhea is bad I get severe nausea. Not just a little sick to my stomach, but very, very severe. I cannot eat for days, sometimes I can barely eat for weeks. I have no appetite and even if i do manage to get hungry I can only eat a couple of bites before I am just too sick to eat anymore.
During this time I also get bad fatigue (I am sure that not eating is partly to blame). My entire body is just tired to the bone. I am an avid runner and a hiker and when these symptoms appear I cannot do either for a few weeks to a month (not to mention when i have the bad days with diarrhea).
These symptoms are not as common as the diarrhea, they only happen, maybe 2 to 3 times a year.
I wonder if this is normal for MC or if it is something else? If it is from MC, do any of the medications that help the diarrhea also help this?
Thank you all for being here. I have been trying over the past month or so to learn all i can online. My doctor does not usually have much time to answer more than one or two questions when I see him so I have had to mostly learn what I can on my own.
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Post by barbaranoela »

Andi-----dont feel like that---U have a Question?--well U just come on in and ask away---any Question is important---someone will always pop in---there are friends here that are so loaded with info that would re-insure *wellness* can be attained--

I am not as *technically* worded to assist U but I can help to encourage U and not to give up----
I wasted many years with a GI---( and I mean MANY) who didnt even know what--nor how to doctor me~~~~

Finally a friend of mine suggested that I get myself into New York City---which I did and my GI there(Dr.Chapman connected with Mount Sinai Hospital) was furious how I was *UN-TREATED*---and he was my salvation~~~~~

I do believe that my issues started from my retired GP who had me on meds for a conditiion Mitro Valve Prolapse --which I DID NOT HAVE!!! :twisted:

How I have learned to walk into my GP(renal issues) with a roll of paper-- :lol: --loaded with questions and how kind he is not to FLUFF anything off!!! NO attending Doc should push a patient outta the door--U make them sit and listen and give U answers!!!!
boy does that ruffle my feathers cus I had been thru that---

So there ya go Andi-----every Question is important!! Fatigue==loss of appetite --depression usually tags along--and being GLUED to the *throne*----oh yes~~~~~~
OH--after reading some of the posts I also had constant nausea----I always referred to it as the hangover *blahs*---well I did like a few drinks--here and there--cant deny that -----C all U learn about us!!!!



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Barbara : :drinking: :smile:
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From CNN.com

Post by JLH »

I went to "doc in the box" because of nausea. He said there are only 3,500 reasons for nausea. I think I found mine while searching for something else.Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:06 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I went to "doc in the box" because of nausea. He said there could be 3,500 reasons but, by George, I think I found the real one accidently.

"People with collagenous colitis and lymphocytic colitis may also experience:

Abdominal pain or cramps
Abdominal bloating (distention)
Modest weight loss
Nausea
Fecal incontinence
Dehydration"

From CNN.com
DISCLAIMER: I am not a doctor and don't play one on TV.

LDN July 18, 2014

Joan
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Andi
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Post by Andi »

I am so happy you were able to find someone in NYC who has been able to help you and to listen to you. I admire you for sticking up for yourself so well. It seems you have to these days, the doctors dont always do it. My primary care doctor is great, but she is not a specialist like my GI. While I love living in rural Vermont and would never want to live elsewhere, the GI options here are limited. I live just outside of Montpelier, but Burlington is not too far away and it may be worth it to find someone up there.
You have been a great help so far.
So, fatigue and nausea are common, i was not sure. At least now i know why off and on for the last 6 years I was getting so sick. I kept going to the doctor and they would do blood tests and stool tests and everything else. Everything came back normal. For the last few years I was really starting to think it was all in my head. Luckily my new primary care doctor thought to send me to a GI who did suspect it was MC. He did the biopsy and it came back positive.
He is really leaning on me to try entocort and I wish he would be a little less pushy about it. He did not even tell me about Asacol, he wanted me to start right away on Entocort. It was my primary care doctor who told me that I should ask him about Asacol. He was reluctant, told me, "it only has a 50 percent success rate". However, I think he should have told me about it and let me make an informed decision.
It is true the Asacol has not worked very well (i think it may be working a little bit but it is hard to tell because i could just be heading into remission. This disease is frustrating because you dont know if meds are helping you or if it is remission sometimes). I just started getting acupuncture treatments and I want to see if those will help. If i decide to do Entocort, i want it to be after I have tried everything else I can.
I just wish i had known about this site a few years ago. For 6 years I would get so sick and not know why.
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Post by JLH »

:welcome: Andi

My choices were Lialda or Entocort...........I found this site (PP) and EnteroLab instead.
DISCLAIMER: I am not a doctor and don't play one on TV.

LDN July 18, 2014

Joan
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Courtney
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Post by Courtney »

Hi Andi,

Don't worry about questioning too much...I've been here for a week questioning away as fast as I can type, so you're in good company :wink: I have had low grade nausea for many years. It doesn't sound like it was as bad as yours, but it was definitely there most of the time. It seems our stories are similar. I also have had this for five-six years, and I was just diagonosed in July with MC and celiac disease. My GI does try, I give him that, but he's not very well-informed on MC or celiac, and he doesn't have a lot of time. I think we're probably better off getting answers here, anyway. If people don't know, they know where to send you, and they definitely know more about what to expect from MC than someone who doesn't have it.

As I mentioned on another thread, I'm on Entocort right now, but would prefer not to be. I've actually lost weight on it which I didn't need to lose (not sure if the meds are to blame, though), and so far I haven't seen much improvement (been on it for about six weeks). I am going to look into Enterolab testing to see if I can get some improvement through diet. I also am a vegetarian, although not as strict as you (I eat fish, dairy, and eggs--or did, no dairy since I realized it definitely causes symptoms), and I can't eat soy products, so I may be looking at bringing meat back into my diet on some level so I can get protein. As I'm one of those vegetarians who just never liked meat, this is not an appetizing thought :neutral: Ah, well.

Keep asking questions. That's the only way we'll know how to get better. :smile:

Courtney
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tex
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Post by tex »

Andi,

There are several possibilities for the nausea, (I had the same problem, during most, but not all, reactions).

1. It could be associated with the MC.
2. It could be associated with diverticulitis.
3. It could be associated with diverticular colitis
4. It could be associated with gastroparesis.

It's kind of unusual for nausea to be present only a few times each year, as a symptom of MC, (if it's a symptom at all - some individuals with MC never have nausea with their reactions), but since your MC seems to wax and wane during the year, that could possibly fit the pattern. At any rate, some of us definitely have serious nausea/vomiting episodes during some of our reactions, (as Courtney just confirmed).

Diverticulitis can certainly cause nausea, but your GI doc should have mentioned this, following your colonoscopy. Do you by any chance have a copy of your colonoscopy report? If there were any diverticuli present, they would be mentioned in the report. GI docs frequently refer to them as "tics", in the report.

There is a rather rare condition known as diverticular colitis, and a significant percentage of these cases result in a stenosis, (narrowing), in the colon, which can occasionally present as a blockage, which will obviously cause nausea/vomiting. Usually, after a few days, diarrhea will re-open the stricture, and the symptoms will pass. Since most diverticuli are located in the Sigmoid colon, that is where the stenosis is usually located. The reason why I am familiar with this issue is because I had emergency abdominal surgery a little less than three years ago, to remove a stenosis of this type, which was causing a blockage in my colon. After my surgery, I requested a copy of the endoscopy report that the GI doc had filed five years earlier, when he was doing a colonoscopy, trying to figure out why I had chronic diarrhea. I discovered that he had noted the stenosis in the report, but he had "forgotten" to mention it to me, in the followup. Hmmmmmmm.

Gastroparesis is a possibility, because I am pretty sure that this is the phenomenon that causes nausea during MC reactions, though it can also be an issue completely independent of MC, also. The vagus nerve stretches from your brainstem to your colon, and part of it's job is to help orchestrate the complex microcircuits in your digestive tract, including signaling the smooth muscles in your stomach to contract in peristaltic waves, in order to mix and move the contents. When these contractions slow, or stop completely, food doesn't move out of your stomach into the duodenum as it should, and this is known as gastroparesis.

Do you by any chance have diabetes? Have you ever had surgery to your stomach, or the upper part of your small intestine? These issues can cause damage to the vagus nerve, which can result in gastroparesis. Were you taking any meds such as narcotic pain medications, tricyclic antidepressants, or calcium channel blockers when this happened? Antacids that contain aluminum hydroxide, certain high blood pressure medications, and lithium, also can disrupt the normal functioning of the stomach. If meds are the cause, usually the symptoms improve after you stop taking the medication.

Unless you have diabetes, or have had gastric surgery, then the most likely suspect is MC. The fatigue that you described certainly is due to the MC, along with brain fog, and general body aches and pains, joint stiffness, headaches, stiff neck, etc.

I can't speak from experience here, but I think that Entocort will help with most of the symptoms that I listed. I'm not sure about Asacol, but since it's a salicylate-based product, it should help to relieve aches and pains that might be present.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Post by annie oakley »

Howdy, I have always had fatique but it worsened when I got Fibro. Hang in there you will fimd your middle ground. It takes time.
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Andi
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Post by Andi »

Tex,
You are a wealth of information. I do not have diabetes or ever had gastric surgery. I have been lucky, never had any surgery at all.
I dont take any narcotic pain relievers, and until I was diagnosed with hypothyroidism last year took no drugs other than ibuprofen for my injury. I am guessing from what you said that my nausea is probably mostly caused by the MC.
Courtney and others, hearing that you have also experienced nausea really help me to realize that this is more common than i thought.
I dont think i can bring meat back in my diet. My not eating meat is a deep spiritual thing for me. I did not choose to not eat it, one day years ago the thought of eating it just made me sick. I do realize that meat has many benefits for people and sometimes I wish i could eat it again. For now the thought of eating meat to me is as appealing as eating a plate of worms. I wish i did not feel this way as I am sure i could get some benefits thru it.
I have noticed that others also seem to have thyroid issues as I do, are they related?
In my life I have taken very few drugs. Until last year i had taken no drugs other than ibuprofen, and then needed to take thyroid drugs. Other than that i take occasional allery medicine, and now asacol. I am pretty sure none of my symptoms are drug related (other than MC which my doctor told me probably was from years of ibuprofen use). I have always been very healthy but in the last year have found I have osteopenia, hypothyroidism, and now MC. There must be a connection.
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Post by tex »

Andi,

Yes, your nausea episodes are almost certainly due to your MC reactions, based on your history.

If you have one autoimmune disease, then you are more susceptible to developing other autoimmune diseases. MC is an autoimmune disease, of course. According to a source that I checked, the prevalance of thyroid problems of any kind in the U. S. is 7.35%. (I have a hunch that number is out of date, and the prevalance is increasing). If you look at the survey that we did on this board, about four months ago, 40% of members who responded are hypothyroid, and 20% are hyperthyroid - that's a whopping 60%, altogether, about eight times the national average. As statistics go, that's an incredibly high correlation, and that doesn't even consider the additional 20% who suspect a thyroid problem, but have never been diagnosed.

Yes, there most definitely is a connection. Not only is the hypothyroidism connected with MC, but your osteoporosis is almost certainly due to a gluten sensitivity that was probably triggered when your MC was triggered.

Tex
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It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Andi
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Post by Andi »

Yes, Tex, I agree. I am certain gluten sensitivity is part of my problem, i just dont know where to begin to do a GF diet. Esp. when I travel so much for work.
I think that thryoid issues are more prevalent because thankfully the experts have finally lowered the TSH levels for hypothyroidism. It used to be much higher and left many, many people undiagnosed. Luckily i have had the last year to learn all i can about thyroid issues. I am still in the dark about MC but am learning just in the last two days on this forum.
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Post by G'ma Mary »

Andi;

Welcome to our "family" and I hope you never again feel the need to apologize for asking questions. Actually, we love them - many of us are here simply to support new folks and to answer your questions.

I first became a member of the former board several years ago, after 6 months on a gluten free diet became symptom free, came over to this board and due to several personal reasons, I stopped posting. Well, I'm back now and happy to meet you!

Anyway, I was diagnosed with MC, Lymphotic type in 2001 after 6 months of symptoms (felt like forever to me, but happy now to have received a diagnosis so quickly!) After joining this forum and visiting with several others about the gluten free diet, I decided (against my GI's advice) to give it a try. In Aug, 2002 I went GF, and by Christmas of that same year I was "mostly" symptom free. Since early 2003 I have remained TOTALLY symptom free and stay gluten free! I am different than most in that I have found no other intolerances. For a while, I believed I could not tolerate sorgum flour, but have more recently eaten it without problems. I am also a vegetarian who eats fish, eggs and dairy. I find I get most of my protein from rice and legumes eaten together and fish. My favorite is wild caught salmon, and I try to eat it weekly for the benefit of all those Omega-3's. I also love poultry, but will eat ONLY organically raised and limit it as much as possible. Avoiding beef, pork, etc is easy for me and is as distasteful to me as you talk about meat being to you.

I understand your reluctance to starting the GF diet due to all your travel and eating out. My personal suggestion is that you continue reading here and thinking about what is best for you. You will come up with your own solution soon enough.

I will look for some of the other sites where I have found info in the past on how to succeed on this diet. As I locate them, I will post them for you (and anyone else).

Welcome to this site and we are happy to have you here, but so sorry for the reason you had to look for us.

G'ma Mary
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Post by G'ma Mary »

Andi;

Well, I've been visiting several old sites I haven't been to in a long time and I found one that continues to have a list I could not have lived without when I began the GF diet. Look at Celiac.com and on the bottom rt side you will find a safe food list and an unsafe food list. I printed those off and carried them with me every time I shopped when I first began the diet. I read every label I ever picked up and found what things I could purchase for myself. I live alone, so my kitchen just became 100% GF!

There is a restaurant site that was somewhat helpful, but I didn't find any in my area. It helped a bit with travel, though. Look at glutenfreerestaurants.org and see if you find anything there that is helpful.

If I run across other sites, I'll let you know. These two have been the best for me, though.

G'ma Mary
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Andi
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Post by Andi »

Thank you so much for the gluten free sights. I dont think I will be able to be hundred percent, not until I retire but I can try to be as close as possible. I never realized gluten was in so many things. It is amazing to me what I am learning.
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