very good article with tables about how much sun exposure we should aim for it is done for individual capital cities and has timings for sun exposure for summer and winter
http://www.australianprescriber.com/magazine/33/4/103/6
Vit D article for the Aussies
Moderators: Rosie, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
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- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
Vit D article for the Aussies
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
Gabes,
That's a good article. I have a question, though. Considering this statement:
One thing that the authors forgot to mention, is that in order for the D3 production process to be successfully completed, the exposed skin cannot be washed, until the cycle is completed, otherwise the vitamin D will be washed away, (since the transformation takes place on the outer skin surface). I don't recall exactly how long that takes, but it is a number of hours. (Does anyone know the correct length of time required?) As important as that bit of information appears to be, it is very, very seldom mentioned in articles discussing the production of vitamin D from sunlight.
Thanks for the link,
Tex
That's a good article. I have a question, though. Considering this statement:
Why is that true? In the northern U. S., all of Canada, and many European countries, it's impossible to get enough sun exposure in the winter, to generate sufficient vitamin D, but in Australia, it appears to be relatively easy. If it takes less than 10 minutes of sun exposure in the summer, and less than about 40 minutes during the winter, virtually anywhere in the country, why are so many people deficient?Australia is well known for its abundance of sunshine. Hence, it is perhaps surprising that vitamin D deficiency is a common condition affecting a large proportion of Australians.
One thing that the authors forgot to mention, is that in order for the D3 production process to be successfully completed, the exposed skin cannot be washed, until the cycle is completed, otherwise the vitamin D will be washed away, (since the transformation takes place on the outer skin surface). I don't recall exactly how long that takes, but it is a number of hours. (Does anyone know the correct length of time required?) As important as that bit of information appears to be, it is very, very seldom mentioned in articles discussing the production of vitamin D from sunlight.
Thanks for the link,
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
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Joefnh
- Rockhopper Penguin
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Tex & Gabes that's interesting. I would defiantly think that vitamin D would not be an issue in Oz, especially from Canberra and points north. Gabes you had mentioned that IBD diseases were also of a high prevalence in Oz and New Zealand, I am wondering if there is an underlying issue (which came first chicken or the egg). Good article on this subject. It looks as if I should be careful using the 38ng/nl number my doctor said was sufficient..
Tex I had no idea that the reaction occurred that close to the surface of the skin such that washing of the skin would diminish the effect. I would have though at that wavelength that deeper penetration would occur.
-Joe
Tex I had no idea that the reaction occurred that close to the surface of the skin such that washing of the skin would diminish the effect. I would have though at that wavelength that deeper penetration would occur.
-Joe
Joe
Joe,
I looked it up. I was thinking that it required about 24 hours - I was wrong. It takes 48 hours. That's probably why most of us don't get full benefit from the sun, as a source of vitamin D. When I'm outdoors, I'm usually working in a hot, dusty environment, handling grain, working livestock, or whatever, and taking a thorough shower or bath is pretty much mandatory, after that.
http://www.thehealthierlife.co.uk/natur ... 98654.html
Tex
I looked it up. I was thinking that it required about 24 hours - I was wrong. It takes 48 hours. That's probably why most of us don't get full benefit from the sun, as a source of vitamin D. When I'm outdoors, I'm usually working in a hot, dusty environment, handling grain, working livestock, or whatever, and taking a thorough shower or bath is pretty much mandatory, after that.
The red emphasis is mine, of course, but I suspect that he's right on the money with that observation.Baby’s out with the bath water
When UVB strikes the surface of your skin, your skin converts a cholesterol derivative in your skin into vitamin D3. The vitamin D3 that is formed is on the surface of your skin does not immediately penetrate into your bloodstream. It actually needs to be absorbed from the surface of your skin into your bloodstream.
New evidence shows it takes up to 48 hours before you absorb the majority of the vitamin D that was generated by exposing your skin to the sun. So, taking a bath or shower with soap will simply wash away much of the vitamin D3 your skin generated, and decrease the benefits of your sun exposure. So to optimize your vitamin D level, you need to delay washing your body with soap for about two full days after sun exposure.
I am probably not wrong in thinking that there is not many of us that will go without a shower or a bath for two days.
The simple way around this, is to only soap the areas of your body that really needs it: underneath your arms and your groin area.
http://www.thehealthierlife.co.uk/natur ... 98654.html
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
This statement in the article makes me a little nervous (emphasis in red is mine):
Gloria
I have little or no fat on my skin right now. I suppose that thin skin means that the vitamin D doesn't have enough area to absorb it???Older people in residential care or those who are hospitalised, particularly people with hip fractures, are at risk of vitamin D deficiency, as are people living in institutional facilities. This is partly explained by age-related thinning of the skin and partly due to reduced sunlight exposure.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
Here is more information on skin than you can shake a stick at, but I don't see any mention of age-related thinning, nor precisely where vitamin D is produced. 
http://www.besthealth.com/besthealth/bo ... s_fin.html
Tex
http://www.besthealth.com/besthealth/bo ... s_fin.html
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Thanks, Tex. With a vit. D level of 62.5, I'm falling short of having a vit. D level of >75, the optimal level suggested in the article. I'm wondering if anyone can achieve that level if even the Australians are deficient.
GloriaVitamin D deficiency can be detected using the 25-hydroxyvitamin D radioimmunoassay. While there is debate as to ideal concentrations, the following could be used to guide a clinical approach:
vitamin D sufficiency > 75 nmol/L
sub-optimal levels 50-75 nmol/L
vitamin D insufficiency 25-50 nmol/L
vitamin D deficiency 15-25 nmol/L
severe vitamin D deficiency < 15 nmol/L.
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
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Gabes-Apg
- Emperor Penguin
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- Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
- Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia
Wow - what a great discussion
Tex
in the past 15 years in Australia due to the high rates of skin cancer (and lots of nasty ones) there was a big big push about sun protection, hats, long sleeve shirts, sunscreen.
It is compulsary for school children to wear hats when playing outside (this did not occur 15 years ago)
it is compulsary for companies to provide SPF 50 clothing for persons who work outdoors (this did no occur 15 years ago)
in the push to 'slip, slop, slap' the tag line for sun protection, slip on a hat, slop on a shirt and slap on some sunscreen -
Majorotity of people dont spend time in the sun unprotected due to the risk of sun cancer
the timings are pretty right - the UV concentration of sunshine hours in Australia is still pretty high, you will note that they say NOT to spend time in the sun between 10am and 2pm which is when UV levels are considered danger level
In Queensland, people still go swimming in winter! especially people from the southern states that come up to QLd for winter holidays. The mornings may be chilly but the weather is beaut in the middle of the day.
Dang it re the 48 hours thing. i dont think i am that keen for natural D3 to not shower for 48 hours.
Tex
in the past 15 years in Australia due to the high rates of skin cancer (and lots of nasty ones) there was a big big push about sun protection, hats, long sleeve shirts, sunscreen.
It is compulsary for school children to wear hats when playing outside (this did not occur 15 years ago)
it is compulsary for companies to provide SPF 50 clothing for persons who work outdoors (this did no occur 15 years ago)
in the push to 'slip, slop, slap' the tag line for sun protection, slip on a hat, slop on a shirt and slap on some sunscreen -
Majorotity of people dont spend time in the sun unprotected due to the risk of sun cancer
the timings are pretty right - the UV concentration of sunshine hours in Australia is still pretty high, you will note that they say NOT to spend time in the sun between 10am and 2pm which is when UV levels are considered danger level
In Queensland, people still go swimming in winter! especially people from the southern states that come up to QLd for winter holidays. The mornings may be chilly but the weather is beaut in the middle of the day.
Dang it re the 48 hours thing. i dont think i am that keen for natural D3 to not shower for 48 hours.
Gabes Ryan
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
Gloria,
My level was 96.8, a year ago, but it's less than half that now. I'm guessing that the loss of my terminal ileum in February, and the use of simvastatin, starting in early May, had a lot to do with that. At the end of summer, I plan to kick my supplementation rate up a notch or three.
Note that the units used in the article are SI, (international), rather than conventional units, (nmol/L rather than ng/mL). To convert, one has to divide the SI number by 2.496, which would give a result of 30 ng/mL.
In international units, my level of a year ago would have been 242 nmol/L.
Tex
My level was 96.8, a year ago, but it's less than half that now. I'm guessing that the loss of my terminal ileum in February, and the use of simvastatin, starting in early May, had a lot to do with that. At the end of summer, I plan to kick my supplementation rate up a notch or three.
Note that the units used in the article are SI, (international), rather than conventional units, (nmol/L rather than ng/mL). To convert, one has to divide the SI number by 2.496, which would give a result of 30 ng/mL.
In international units, my level of a year ago would have been 242 nmol/L.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Gabes,
Well, that explains it, all right. The pattern over here has been very similar, also.
Tex
Well, that explains it, all right. The pattern over here has been very similar, also.
I hear you. Of course, theoretically, you can still shower, as long as you don't use soap. Direct sun exposure pretty well guarantees a lot of perspiration, (at least during warm weather), and rinsing with water, (no soap), doesn't sound as though it would be very effective for cleaning. In my case, I wear a long sleeve shirt year round, so my main sun absorption areas are my hands, and my face and neck area. They always have a great tan, but if I didn't wash my face and neck with soap, before bedtime, my pillow would get mighty oily, mighty fast. It's pretty much impossible to eliminate soap for hand washing, also, since I handle all sorts of things during the day - things that I wouldn't want on my food, or anywhere else, for that matter. LOL.Gabes wrote:Dang it re the 48 hours thing. i dont think i am that keen for natural D3 to not shower for 48 hours.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
