TendrTummy - eating goat cheese?

moremuscle · Post by **moremuscle** » Tue Jun 14, 2005 9:52 am

Hi Christine,

How's the tummy? And the elbow? Sorry to hear you are having all this trouble. I know it will get better as you get a better at controlling your diet - it's not easy to control your diet when you are multiply intolerant. Give yourself a lot of credit for trying so hard and hanging in there - and here is a big HUG from me (((((Christine)))))

Christine, I read a little of your last entries in your journal. I noticed that you had goat cheese with your dinner one night - was it yesterday?

I thought you were dairy free? Casein intolerant? Am I mistaken?

If you are casein intolerant you really cannot tolerate goat cheese either. Unfortunately, it has casein - it has less casein or a different kind of casein, I can't remember which, than cows milk but it still has casein so your immune system will recognize it and launch an attack. This could be the reason for your misery today.

You are eating some nuts and I noticed the cashews too - are you sure you are OK with all the nuts? A lot of people here tend not to do so well with raw nuts especially in significant quantities. I eat nuts too - mostly walnuts and almonds and I don't have any problems I can attribute to the nuts but I try to limit the intake. I even eat toasted peanuts and do OK with them. Just keep an eye on the nuts and how they affect you. You could consider eliminating nuts for a week to see if you start to feel differently w/o them.

Another note about nuts: Some nuts have some preservatives added in order to prevent them from turning rancid (an example is Diamond brand Walnuts) - check the label to see if there is anything added to the nuts. You don't want the additives since they can be corn derived.

I hope you are feeling better already.

Love,
Karen

Hi again, Christine -

After sending this post to you I went on the net to google goats milk in relation to casein. It turns out that I may be wrong about assuming there is casein in goats milk - in the following link it says there is only trace amounts of the casein known from cow's milk. On the other hand there is another type of protein that is allergenic in goat's milk. I would still eliminate the goat's milk if I were you.
I would be curiuos to hear the opinion of others who are casein intolerant - do they think it is safe to eat goat's cheese?

Karen

http://askdrsears.com/html/3/t032400.asp

Here is another link to info about goat's milk. It does definitely contain some casein - even if the casein is different from that in cow's milk.

http://www.gardenharvest.org/milkbenefits.htm

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Tue Jun 14, 2005 10:58 am

Karen,

Yes, I've been having very small amounts of goats and sheeps cheese..

The book I've been reading, the Allergy Self-Help Cookbook, suggests you CAN enjoy goats milk and sheeps milk if intolerant of cows milk.. the theory is that this is something we as americans have not been consuming and therefore have not had enough exposure to it to develop an allergy. I'd be interested to hear Polly's opinion on this.. she has the same book, almost the same intolerances.. I don't know if she's been eating goats or sheeps cheese..

Christine

kate_ce1995 · Post by **kate_ce1995** » Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:35 am

If you go search on the old site, you'll find Polly's experiences with goat and sheep cheese, which she unfortunately can't tolerate, although if I'm remembering right, her husband really liked! Talk about insult to injury...I'm sorry dear you can't eat this, but yum its good! Okay, I may be telling this a little off...she can fill you in.

Katy

moremuscle · Post by **moremuscle** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:43 am

Hi Christine,

Looks like Polly is back from the beach - maybe she will find this post today and tell us what she thinks.

I looked at your journal again a minute ago. You describe your symptoms as being worse one hour after eating the lunch w/ goats cheese. This sounds like a dairy reaction to me. Many here (in the old GF Kitchen) have described their milk reactions as being fast - within an hour or two. I don't think I've ever had a dairy slip myself so I don't know how fast I react to it.

I hope you are feeling better this morning.

Love,
Karen

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:14 am

Yeah, I hope she comments too..

I noted the reaction I had after lunch, but I also noted that I have this same reaction almost every day about an hour after lunch, it's like that's the point at which it's hitting my duodenum or small intestine and things just CRAMP UP.. so it's been happening every day, but I decided I should start taking note of it - symptoms and time.. so while it COULD be the dairy, dunno.. I guess we'll see if Polly has anything to add or can shed some light on this mystery.. perhaps I should just eat the whole square of cheese and see if I get a reaction LOL That's what I feel like doing these days..

Christine

Polly · Post by **Polly** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:03 pm

Here I am! Yep, I tried both goat's and sheep's cheeses with great hope and optimism that I would be able to tolerate them. Alas, that was not to be. WAHHHHHH. Both gave me acid battery D within 2 hours of eating them.

I was SOOOO disappointed - I know you all know from my frequent whining that cheese is what I miss the most.

And yes, Scott loved both of them so the remainder was quickly eaten up.

I was so jealous.

Christine - I sure hope that you will be able to eat at least one of them. Go ahead and give it a full try - if you feel up to it! Actually, I did my trial on a weekend when I knew I did not have to go out of the house! LOL!Good luck.

Love,

Polly

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:41 pm

Hmmmm maybe I'll do that..

How do you think I should approach it?? Have like one SLICE? (like on top of a hamburger?) or should I have a whole BLOCK of it? lol j/k.. no really.. should I try like a cheeseburgers worth or do you think it should be more than that?

Christine

Post by **tex** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 3:17 pm

Christine,

I'm not saying that this the proper way to do it, but my strategy on challenges, is to eat enough to get a valid test, so that you dont' have to wonder what would happen if you ate a little more. Also, if you're gonna get sick anyway, you might as well eat enough to make it worthwhile. LOL. YMMV.

Tex

moremuscle · Post by **moremuscle** » Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:19 pm

oH, NO Christine, don't do it

I would hate to see you being sick from this trial

Oh well, if you have to, I guess you have to - better go all out and get it over with for once and for all; or better even, you'll discover that you can tolerate it :cool:

I used to love goats cheese (I don't see a goat smily so here is a

)

Love,
Karen

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 4:12 am

well....

If I do a trial, which I will, it's not going to be for about 2 weeks.. I'm not going to do that during the week, I have a hard enuf time getting to work. I'll do it on a weekend; however, THIS particular weekend we are *booked*.. so it'd make things very difficult if I had a reaction.. So it'll wait a coupla weeks, but I'll let you all know what happens :)

Christine

starfire · Post by **starfire** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 6:39 am

Christine,
I have been reading your journal and I am amazed at the problems you have and the doctors don't seem to know what to do next. I wish I could help you somehow. I'm not sure I could continue to go to work feeling the way you do most of the time.

Love, Shirley

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 6:55 am

Shirl,

Yeah, I'm not sure either.. but you know, if I quit right now, I'd owe them 98 hours of PTO, because of my gall bladder time off. I'm "in the hole" so to speak. I don't get ANY time off (paid) until September. Even then it's only 16 hours. for the YEAR. So I'm pretty much chained to my desk.

Christine

TendrTummy · Post by **TendrTummy** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 11:52 am

Hey all! I just wanted to add on to this thread -

I emailed Enterolabs about this question and this is the response I got:

From: EnteroLab Support [mailto:enterolab@earthlink.net]
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2005 12:05 PM
To: Christine Neutgens
Subject: re: casein

Dear Christine,

Thank you for your questions.

You will find casein in all mammal milk, but their are some differences between the species regarding the amino acid chains, etc. Also, the smaller the animal, the less amount of casein the milk will have. This may just mean that it would take a longer period of time for the antibodies to form if you are sensitive to other animal casein.

Some patients have said they can tolerate sheep or goat's milk, but everyone is different in this respect. You may wish to try it, but know that you may get the same type of reaction as from cow's milk.

Most sincerely,

Phyllis Zermeno, RN, BSN
Clinical Manager, EnteroLab
http://www.enterolab.com

moremuscle · Post by **moremuscle** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 1:09 pm

Christine,

This is interesting information from Enterolab - that some patients say they can tolerate sheep or goat milm. I am almost tempted to try some goat's cheese!! I think I'll wait until I want to be sick again.

Love,
Karen

mle_ii · Post by **mle_ii** » Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:06 pm

My sister cannot tollerate normal dairy, but goats cheese appears to be something that she can tollerate. Not sure if it's the casein or lactose that's the difference for her though.

MICROSCOPIC COLITIS SUPPORT

TendrTummy - eating goat cheese?

TendrTummy - eating goat cheese?

hmm

yeah

Lol

well....

lol

goat cheese